Theos-Talk Archives (March 2006 Message tt01083)

Vince
       When you mention "wholistic" regarding the fact the TS includes other works besides HPBs, you raise an interesting point.
      I was originally involved with the TS years ago, and I felt as if I had found a mother-lode of metaphysical occult literature. and this is true. Over the years, however, I found my own tastes changing from an open texture rather undisciplined sense of study to a "way" of my own, and I began to eliminate texts which, to me, where too indirect regarding the Path of individual work. I wanted to know what I needed to actually do to know Wisdom, which wisdom was really neccesary for my own "awakening", and most importantly-what are the Masters of Wisdom. I found that some texts were concerned with the fundemental teachings of the ancient wisdom, without concern for the author, just the learning of the student. I found that many were not and made claims of visions and knowledge, which seemed to me, to jump ahead of what I could verify as real. So, I kept finding myself going back to the fundemental teachings regarding the neccesary changes I had to make in me, with which I would know
 what is real and what is not. My biggest problem was always me and my  lack of patience. I needed to rid myself of the so-called normal time sense of people in our time, which prompts us to quickly and prematurely aquire powers before we understand what power is. I kept finding that some few texts want the student to find out what a human being is, the knowledge of which I thought I had, being preumptious and shallow. Which really means, that for a shallow nature to aquire power would be dangerous.
       Therefore, I kept finding myself being attracted back to HPB's writings, along with Patanjali, the Dalai Lama, and other insightful Buddhist thinkers like Santideva, who deal in ethical growth along side, but actually preceding, the metaphysical study, for the sake of psychological balance. Their motive is service as the key to finding out who you are and your capacities, while an unbalanced study may still allow for selfishness, and misuse of knowledge.
       Well, thats the Path of study for me, but it came about through an open study of pretty much everything.
   
  Steve

Vincent <vblaz2004@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
  Steve-

Actually, my primary intent for recently getting involved with the 
Theosophical Society of Wheaton has mostly to do with having a place 
wherein I may freely believe what I already do, and learn new things 
of a metaphysical content as well.

When I was formerly involved with Christian fundamentalist churches, 
I found myself judged and restricted whenever attempting to bring up 
metaphysical concepts in open discussion format. I was told that I 
was not being 'doctrinal', and that my metaphysical experiences 
were 'demonic', insofar as they were not strictly aligned with 
Christian doctrine.

However, my initial impression of the Theosophical Society is that 
it is accepting of a variety of religious traditions, and not solely 
specific to HPB's writings. It is more wholistic. Please correct 
me if I am wrong on this.

Vince

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Steven Levey wrote:
>
> Ah Vince, that's a mighty deep rational you have for what you do. 
Hopefully you will get from us exactly what you aught.
> 
> Steve
> 
> Vincent wrote:
> Steve-
> 
> I appreciate your insight and your suggestion, and I see the value 
> to it. It's just that at this specific time in my life, my focus 
> must be a little bit different. In other words, I've already 
poured 
> many thousands of hours into various metaphysical texts over the 
> last twenty years, and have therefore arrived at a very complex 
and 
> advanced metaphysical belief system as a result. At this time, I 
am 
> undertaking the attempt to write a volume as large as HPB's, and 
> therefore cannot dedicate fully researching a brand new text.
> 
> I suggest that there exist the roles of teachers whose specific 
task 
> is to dispense information to others, if they do not have the 
> immediate time and energy to gather it for themselves. I'm not 
> saying that direct readings of HPB lack value in any way. That's 
> just not where I'm at right now.
> 
> Currently, I engage in trance conditioning through natural 
> physiological disciplines, without the use of chemical modifiers. 
> This means that I interact directly with spirit entities, seeing 
> them and hearing them when I enter into trance. And this is the 
> level from whence my writings will manifest inspiration. I am just 
> curious to see what degree of alignment exists between HPB's 
> writings and my own belief system at this time, so I'd like to 
learn 
> more through those gifted teachers and students of HPB.
> 
> Vince
> 
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Steven Levey wrote:
> >
> > Vince
> > 
> > I am aware of how daunting the very thickness of these 
> texts can appear, but I really think that you are doing yourself a 
> great disservice, by not doing the study yourself, and expecting 
> others to, sort of, hand it to you in some palatable form intended 
> just for you. This is a great deal like going to church or temple 
> and expecting the paid servent on the pulpit to do the same thing. 
> > Now please, don't take this wrong, but an important aspect 
> of the philosophy of becoming a discriminating human being and 
> student, is, so that what you find for yourself will be something 
> you can trust in. "We are all Gods", says the ancient wisdom, 
> or "You too can do what I have done" as Jesus says. In other 
words, 
> we have what we need within us, we just have to flesh it out. That 
> is the purpose of theosophical thought, not the memorization of 
> thick texts. But the study of them, and application of what we see 
> as true, brings rewards immediately, as the mind wakes up to its 
own 
> powers of wisdom and discrimination.
> > 
> > Steve
> > 
> > Vincent wrote:
> > Steve-
> > 
> > I'm just trying to understand what I can about Theosophy, 
insofar 
> as 
> > it is new to me. HPB's writings are so extensive in such large 
> > volumes that I'm honestly a little bit daunted as to where to 
> begin, 
> > so I'm likely going to be relying on secondary abridgments for 
> > awhile. In other words, someone's probably going to have to 
teach 
> > it to me in the form of abridged quotes, before I get into 
> extensive 
> > reading of the core volumes.
> > 
> > Christians claim that the Bible contains 'absolute truth', both 
> > inerrant and infallible. But this then leaves those portions of 
> > universal truth concerning which we lack a firm and total grasp. 
> > Namely 'occult' truth, or anything which has not been declared 
to 
> > be 'absolute truth' by the Christian community. Hence universal 
> > truth may potentially be subdivided into categories of 'absolute 
> > truth' and 'occult truth'. Of course, I don't believe that any 
of 
> > us really has a firm grasp on 'absolute truth' in the first 
place, 
> > insofar as our minds are mortal, and we commonly have errors 
> > somewhere in every belief that we hold, whether small or great. 
> > Hence so many different biblical interpretations among 
Christians.
> > 
> > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Steven Levey wrote:
> > >
> > > Vince-
> > > 
> > > Your intution about the reason for the term "Secret" in The 
> > Secret Doctrine is somewhat correct, but, it is also a bit to 
> quick 
> > a judgement. I'm afraid you are going to have to study the 
thing, 
> to 
> > get a really good idea about the use of her terms. However, in 
> doing 
> > so, I found it wise to read HPB in a thorough way to begin to 
> > undestand her motivation. By this I mean, read The Key to 
> Theosophy, 
> > and study The Voice of the Silence, as well, or something like 
> that. 
> > Or, pick up one of her collected writtings of shorter articles, 
or 
> > the Panarion. Mostly all of these are available at the Public 
> > Library, but definately on-line or in Theosophy Lodges of 
> different 
> > types.
> > > 
> > > Good Searching-Steve
> > > 
> > > Vincent Blazina wrote:
> > > Perry:
> > > 
> > > Thanks for the welcome. The Jehovah's Witnesses that you refer 
> > also seem to have some narrow biblical interpretations, much 
like 
> > Christian fundamentalists. I'm curious about what some of the 
> > similarities and differences are between the Bible and the 
Secret 
> > Doctrine. Why is the Secret Doctrine considered to be secret? 
Does 
> > this simply mean that it is occult (meaning hidden) in nature? 
My 
> > own biblical interpretations go very deep for me, and are 
anything 
> > but dry, although I view Christian fundamentalists as often 
> shallow 
> > in their own biblical interpretations much of the time.
> > > 
> > > Vince
> > > 
> > > plcoles1 
> > > wrote:
> > > Hello Vince, 
> > > Welcome to theos-talk!
> > > My background was in the Jehovah's Witnesses and so as a 
result 
> > had what amounted to at 
> > > least 5 1/2 hours a week of meetings to attend, and NO 
> questioning 
> > what you were being 
> > > told.
> > > 
> > > The thing I've found with studying theosophy for someone who 
has 
> > studied the Bible is 
> > > that theosophy and in particular the Secret Doctrine opens up 
> many 
> > interesting and 
> > > profound interpretations of passages in the Bible.
> > > 
> > > An interesting article written by H.P Blavatsky is `The 
Esoteric 
> > character of the Gospels'
> > > http://www.theosociety.org/pasadena/hpb-sio/sio-eso2.htm
> > > It's a good place to start as the Secret Doctrine can be a 
> little 
> > bit daunting to begin with.
> > > 
> > > After only hearing what was to me very empty and dry 
> > interpretations of the Bible, 
> > > theosophy can help you to begin to get some kind of 
> understanding 
> > as to the deeper 
> > > meaning in the bible as well as what other great thinkers, 
sages 
> > and philosophers from 
> > > various traditions have taught on these subjects which may 
help 
> > you have some context 
> > > and reference point for your own experiences.
> > > Very Best Wishes on your Spiritual journey and once again 
> Welcome 
> > to the theos-talk!
> > > 
> > > Regards
> > > 
> > > Perry
> > > 
> > > --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "vblaz20042004" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi there, I'm Vince and I am new to the group. I have 
recently 
> > been 
> > > > attending the Theosophical Society of Wheaton, Illinois for 
> the 
> > past 
> > > > month, and have been enjoying the various teachings and 
> > discussions 
> > > > at that facility.
> > > > 
> > > > My life has been rich with metaphysical experiences, but the 
> > > > Christian Fundamentalist churches that I had previously 
> attended 
> > for 
> > > > twenty years got very judgmental towards me when I might 
> venture 
> > to 
> > > > reference them. I also began finding many inconsistencies 
with 
> > the 
> > > > way that many Christians were representing the Bible, and my 
> > > > questions about Christianity were often deemed dangerous to 
> > people's 
> > > > religious faith.
> > > > 
> > > > I am looking for a place in the Theosophical Society wherein 
I 
> > may 
> > > > potentially freely discuss metaphysical issues as they 
> directly 
> > > > pertain to my life, with people who are more open to such 
> > > > discussions. I am very well read with the Bible, although my 
> > > > interpretations of it are more metaphysical versus orthodox.
> > > > 
> > > > I look forward to constuctive discussion with the people 
here, 
> > and 
> > > > would like to learn more about the Theosophical Society and 
> it's 
> > > > perspectives, insofar as many of them are brand new to me.
> > > > 
> > > > Thank you,
> > > > 
> > > > Vince
> > > >
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
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> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
> > > 
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