Theos-Talk Archives (March 2006 Message tt00183)

Dear Carlos
   
        No, my friend, these group issues are not "healthy", they are indicitive of shortsightedness on the part of students and especially on Group directors. It is high time that we learned from our errors of the past, and keep a "healthy" system of checks and balances in the group, to being with. How this is done will obviously need to be decided by each group, but at minimum, as this group on-line is experiencing, "reality therapy" through continuous reminders of HPB's work as it is, helps a great deal. 
   
  Steve

carlosaveline cardoso aveline <carlosaveline@hotmail.com> wrote:
  
Dear Steven,

I guess all human groups or institutions will have and must have
organization issues.

It is healthy. Carlos.

>From: Steven Levey 
>Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: "POOR COWARDS" IN ADYAR
>Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2006 09:03:28 -0800 (PST)
>
>Dear Carlos,
>
> One more point on this. Organizational issues are, ironically, not 
>exempt from ULT. By that I don't mean that there are neccesarily any 
>dictatorial efforts or prepared dogmatic doctrinal statements as to how 
>Theosophy will be tauhgt in Lodges. But Group dynamics impose dogmatic 
>thinking in different lodges.
>
> Steve
>
>carlosaveline cardoso aveline wrote:
>
>
>Dear Steven,
>
>Yes. Thanks.
>
>It may sound strange, but there has always been a current of sincere
>Blavatsky students within the Adyar society.
>
>E. L. Gardner, Geoffrey Farthing and several other well-known 20th century
>theosophists in England, as well as some lifelong students in Argentina,
>Brazil, Mexico, Portugal and in many other countries expressed that 
>tendency
>until recently inside the Adyar Society.
>
>Even now, many sincere Adyar members will tell you privately that 
>Leadbeater
>is a complete disaster and that HPB is the reliable source, etc.
>
>So I guess Robert Crosbie, the founder of the United Lodge of Theosophists
>in 1909, was indeed right when he stated that the connection with the
>source of inspiration is to be made individually and not through corporate
>organizations.
>
>We should get rid of imperial, top-down, bureaucratic power-structures in
>our organizations, in order to have more freedom in our individual search.
>Organizations are important as long instruments --- as they help 
>individuals
>and do not reduce them to blind obedience...
>
>At least, that is my vision of things by now.
>
>
>Best regards, Carlos.
>
>
>
> >From: Steven Levey
> >Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> >Subject: Re: Theos-World Re: HPB SEES "POOR COWARDS" IN ADYAR
> >Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2006 08:09:12 -0800 (PST)
> >
> >Carlos,
> >
> > As much as I agree in the radical unity of the Movement, it seems
> >to me that those who impart legitamacy to the outer work of the
> >Movement-The Mahatmas, having long ago withdrawn such support from the
> >Adyar aspect of the Movement, does leave them in a precarious situation.
> >That is, perhaps overly active pretentions on their part, as in the same
> >kind of behaviour anyone of us might foolishly rationalize, will leave us
> >by default, with an equal and appropriate lack of guidence from our 
>Higher
> >Self. The karma of this has little connection sentiment.
> >
> > Steve
> >
> >carlosaveline cardoso aveline wrote:
> >
> >
> >Dear Steve,
> >
> >Yes, we must learn from our past mistakes in order not to keep
> >repeating them...
> >
> >Besides, there is no real separation between Adyar Society and the
> >theosophical
> >movement at large, at the occult level.
> >
> >Best regards, Carlos.
> >
> >
> > >From: Steven Levey
> > >Reply-To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > >To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
> > >Subject: Re: Theos-World HPB SEES "POOR COWARDS" IN ADYAR
> > >Date: Fri, 3 Mar 2006 07:44:26 -0800 (PST)
> > >
> > >Dear Carlos,
> > >
> > > Fine reporting. These are evidences that open minds cannot dismiss.
> > > It makes me think that we are totally responsible for the state of
> > >Theosophical affairs as they are today, and that our duty is clearly to
> > >work with our eyes open upon the present, with the addition of an
> > >occassional bit of hindsite to see that the traps of the past are 
>always
> > >lurking in the present.
> > >
> > > Steve
> > >
> > >carlosaveline cardoso aveline wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Dear Friends in Theos-talk,
> > >
> > >ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> > >
> > >The Coulomb’s and Solovyof’s Libels:
> > >
> > >H.P.B. SEES “POOR MISERABLE COWARDS” IN ADYAR.
> > >
> > >ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
> > >
> > >
> > >For several years now, the Adyar Esoteric School and the Adyar TS 
>leaders
> > >in
> > >India have been doing nothing while “editors” like John Algeo and 
>Daniel
> > >Caldwell try to incorporate into the theosophical literature the worst
> > >libels and lies created by the Coulombs and by Mr. Solovyof against
> >H.P.B.
> > >(1)
> > >
> > >For some reason, Adyar TS people in India seem to have forgotten that
> > >H.P.B. was the founder of the theosophical movement and of the Esoteric
> > >School.
> > >
> > >If you make an effort to clarify their position, perhaps you can get a
> > >personal letter from Mrs. Radha Burnier accepting the fact that those
> >false
> > >letters ascribed to H.P.B. are “obviously spurious” – and kindly 
>telling
> > >you that she considers herself free from any responsibility as to
> > >publishing those “theosophical” libels against the Messenger.
> > >
> > >What is the meaning of such a thing? In fact, time is cyclic and this
> > >situation in Adyar is far from being entirely new.
> > >
> > >When these very same forgeries and libels first appeared during the
> >1880s,
> > >H.P. Blavatsky had something to say about the Adyar leaders’ position 
>in
> > >that occasion – an occasion, by the way, which was essentially similar
> > >to the one we live now, although everything was much more dramatic in
> >those
> > >crucial times.
> > >
> > >In a letter to A. P. Sinnett, H.P.B. asked herself:
> > >
> > >“”Why should my best friends allow me to be so vilified!”” (2)
> > >
> > >And then she commented:
> > >
> > >““While my enemies tear me to pieces the Adyar people play at ‘hide and
> > >seek’ – they pretend to be dead – Oh! the poor miserable cowards!! 
>(...)
> >I
> > >tell you I suffer more from theosophical ‘traitors’ than from the
> >Coulomb,
> > >Patterson or even the S.P.R.”” (3)
> > >
> > >
> > >I wish I could say the situation has improved since the 1880s.
> > >
> > >It hasn’t, so far. But I hope it can still improve – and I add; the
> >sooner
> > >the better.
> > >
> > >
> > >Best regards, Carlos Cardoso Aveline, from Brazil.
> > >
> > >
> > >O o o O o o O o o O o o O o o O
> > >
> > >
> > >NOTES:
> > >
> > >(1) This was done in their books “The Letters of H.P. Blavatsky, Volume
> >I”
> > >(J. Algeo) and “The Esoteric World of Madame Blavatsky” (D. Caldwell).
> >Both
> > >were published by the TPH in the USA.
> > >
> > >(2) “The Letters of H.P. Blavatsky to A.P. Sinnett”, T.U.P., Pasadena,
> >USA,
> > >1973, Letter XLVI, see p. 112.
> > >
> > >(3) Same Letter, see Note (2) above, but on page 114.
> > >
> > >
> > >O o o O o o O o o O o o O o o O
> > >
> > >_________________________________________________________________
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