Theos-Talk Archives (July 2005 Message tt00201)

July 28 2005

Dear G:

So having said all is "maya"  

I ask: WHO SAYS THAT ?

Can we assume that a unit of UNIVERSAL CONSCIOUSNESS (?) embodied in the
vestures of "maya" is enabled to say that ?

Let me quote:

"It is by means of the outward senses and their inner counterparts that a
great turmoil is set up in the whole system, which spreads to the heart and
from there to the mind, and, as it is elsewhere said: "The restless heart
then snatches away the mind from its steady place."
 
We thus have to carry on the cultivation of the soul by regular stages,
never neglecting one part at the expense of another. Krishna advises his
friend to restrain the senses, and then to "strengthen himself by himself." 

The meaning here is that he is to rely upon the One Consciousness which, as
differentiated in a man, is his higher self. By means of this higher self he
is to strengthen the lower, or that which he is accustomed to call "myself."


It will not be amiss here to quote from some notes of conversation with a
friend of mine. 

"Our consciousness is one and not many, nor different from other
consciousnesses. It is
not waking consciousness or sleeping consciousness, or any other but
consciousness itself. 

"Now that which I have called consciousness is Being. The ancient division
was: 

Sat, or Being; 

Chit, or Consciousness, Mind; } These together are called Sat-chit-ananda.


Ananda, or Bliss. 
 
"But Sat— or Being— the first of the three, is itself both Chit and Ananda.
The appearing together in full harmony of Being and Consciousness is Bliss
or Ananda. Hence that harmony is called Sat-chit-ananda. 

"But the one consciousness of each person is the Witness or Spectator of the
actions and experiences of every state we are in or pass through. It
therefore follows that the waking condition of the mind is not separate
consciousness. 

"The one consciousness pierces up and down through all the states or planes
of Being, and serves to uphold the memory— whether complete or incomplete—
of each state's experiences. 

"Thus in waking life, Sat experiences fully and knows. In dream state, Sat
again knows and sees what goes on there, while there may not be in the brain
a complete memory of the 
waking state just quitted. In Sushupti— beyond dream and yet on
indefinitely, Sat still knows all that is done or heard or seen. 

"The way to salvation must be entered. To take the first step raises the
possibility of success. 

Hence it is said, 'When the first attainment has been won, Moksha
(salvation) has been won.' 

"The first step is giving up bad associations and getting a longing for
knowledge of God; the second is joining good company, listening to their
teachings and practicing them; the third is strengthening the first two
attainments, having faith and continuing in it. Whoever dies thus, lays the
sure foundation for ascent to adeptship, or salvation."
BHAGAVAD GITA Nots pp 98 - 100


My problem is with expressions of doctrine, Buddhist, Advaita, Theosophical
--


Since we use translations, something of the force and meaning of the
original expressions may be lost.

How do we secure a logical meaning regardless of "doctrine ?"


I look at PATANJALI YOGA APHORISMS Book 4 pp. 70 - 72 so as to compare
statements:


"21. When the understanding and the soul are united, then self-knowledge
results. 

The self-knowledge spoken of here is that interior illumination desired by
all mystics, and is not merely a knowledge of self in the ordinary sense. 

22. The mind, when united with the soul and fully conversant with knowledge,
embraces universally all objects. 

23. The mind, though assuming various forms by reason of innumerable mental
deposits, exists for the purpose of the soul's emancipation and operates in
co-operation therewith. 

24. In him who knows the difference between the nature of soul and mind, the
false notion regarding the soul comes to an end.

The mind is merely a tool, instrument, or means, by which the soul acquires
experiences and knowledge. In each incarnation the mind is, as it were, new.
It is a portion of the apparatus furnished to the soul through innumerable
lives for obtaining experience and reaping the fruit of works performed. The
notion that the mind is either knower or experiencer is a false one, which
is to be removed before emancipation can be reached by soul. It was
therefore said that the mind operates or exists for the carrying out of the
soul's salvation, and not the soul for the mind's sake. When this is fully
understood, the permanency of soul is seen, and all the evils flowing from
false ideas begin to disappear. 

25. Then the mind becomes deflected toward discrimination and bowed down
before Isolation. 

26. But in the intervals of meditation other thoughts arise, in consequence
of the continuance of old impressions not yet expunged. 

27. The means to be adopted for the avoidance and elimination of these are
the same as before given for obviating the afflictions. 

28. If the ascetic is not desirous of the fruits, even when perfect
knowledge has been attained, and is not inactive, the meditation technically
called Dharma Megha-cloud of virtue-takes place from his absolutely perfect
discriminative knowledge. 

The commentator explains that, when the ascetic has reached the point
described in Aphorism 25, if he bends his concentration toward the
prevention of all other thoughts, and is not desirous of attaining the
powers resulting just at his wish, a further state of meditation is reached
which is called "cloud of virtue," because it is such as will, as it were,
furnish the spiritual rain for the bringing about of the chief end of the
soul-entire emancipation. And it contains a warning that, until that chief
end is obtained, the desire for fruits is an obstacle. 

29. Therefrom results the removal of the afflictions and all works.

30. Then, from infinity of knowledge absolutely free from obscuration and
impurity, that which is knowable appears small and easy to grasp. 

31. Thereupon, the alternation in the modifications of the qualities, having
accomplished the soul's aim-experience and emancipation-comes to an end. 

32. It is then perceived that the moments and their order of precedence and
succession are the same. 

This is a step further than Aphorism 53, Book III, where it is stated that
from discrimination of ultimates of time a perception of the very subtle and
recondite principles of the universe results. Here, having arrived at
Isolation, the ascetic sees beyond even the ultimates, and they, although
capable of affecting the man who has not reached this stage, are for the
ascetic identical, because he is a master of them. It is extremely difficult
to interpret this aphorism; and in the original it reads that "the order is
counterpart of the moment." To express it in another way, it may be said
that in the species of meditation adverted to in Aphorism 53, Book III, a
calculative cognition goes forward in the mind, during which, the
contemplator not yet being thoroughly master of these divisions of time, is
compelled to observe them as they pass before him. 

[From BOOK III:

"50. In the ascetic who has acquired the accurate discriminative knowledge
of the truth and of the nature of the soul, there arises a knowledge of all
existences in their essential natures and a mastery over them. 

51. In the ascetic who acquires an indifference even to the last mentioned
perfection, through having destroyed the last germs of desire, there comes a
state of the soul that is called Isolation. [See note on Isolation in Book
IV.] 

52. The ascetic ought not to form association with celestial beings who may
appear before him, nor exhibit wonderment at their appearance, since the
result would be a renewal of afflictions of the mind. 

53. A great and most subtile knowledge springs from the discrimination that
follows upon concentration of the mind performed with regard to the relation
between moments and their order. 

In this Patanjali speaks of ultimate divisions of time which cannot be
further divided, and of the order in which they precede and succeed each
other. It is asserted that a perception of these minute periods can be
acquired, and the result will be that he who discriminates thus goes on to
greater and wider perception of principles in nature which are so recondite
that modern philosophy does not even know of their existence. We know that
we can all distinguish such periods as days or hours, and there are many
persons, born mathematicians, who are able to perceive the succession of
minutes and can tell exactly without a watch how many have elapsed between
any two given points in time. The minutes, so perceived by these
mathematical wonders, are, however, not the ultimate divisions of time
referred to in the Aphorism, but are themselves composed of such ultimates.
No rules can be given for such concentration as this, as it is so far on the
road of progress that the ascetic finds the rules himself, after having
mastered all the anterior processes. 


[ DTB -- "Ultimate divisions of time (?)" -- Finite time is measured
during Manvantaras. Infinite time (duration), may be said to be
immeasurable and infinite --- including both Manvantaras and Pralayas
without number. Yet one may guess that KARMA, CAUSATION, UNIVERSAL MIND
(MAHAT) and CYCLES prevail as a portion ( DHARMA ?) of the changeless
ABSOLUTE.]


54. Therefrom results in the ascetic a power to discern subtile differences
impossible to be known by other means. 

55. The knowledge that springs from this perfection of discriminative power
is called "knowledge that saves from rebirth." It has all things and the
nature of all things for its objects, and perceives all that hath been and
that is, without limitations of time, place, or circumstance, as if all were
in the present and the presence of the contemplator. 

Such an ascetic as is referred to in this and the next aphorism, is a
Jivanmukta and is not subject to reincarnation. He, however, may live yet
upon earth but is not in any way subject to his body, the soul being
perfectly free at every moment. And such is held to be the state of those
beings called, in theosophical literature, Adepts, Mahatmas, Masters. 


[ DTB Yet, they have renounced Nirvana to remain with struggling mankind. ]


56. When the mind no longer conceives itself to be the knower, or
experiencer, and has become one with the soul-the real knower and
experiencer-Isolation takes place and the soul is emancipated. " -- End
of BOOK III quote]


33. The reabsorption of the qualities which have consummated the aim of the
soul or the abiding of the soul united with understanding in its own nature,
is Isolation. 

This is a general statement of the nature of Isolation, sometimes called
Emancipation. The qualities before spoken of, found in all objects and which
had hitherto affected and delayed the soul, have ceased to be mistaken by it
for realities, and the consequence is that the soul abides in its own nature
unaffected by the great "pairs of opposites"-pleasure and pain, good and
evil, cold and heat, and so forth. 

Yet it must not be deduced that the philosophy results in a negation, or in
a coldness, such as our English word "Isolation" would seem to imply. The
contrary is the case. Until this state is reached, the soul, continually
affected and deflected by objects, senses, suffering, and pleasure, is
unable to consciously partake universally of the great life of the universe.
To do so, it must stand firmly "in its own nature"; and then it proceeds
further -as is admitted by the philosophy-to bring about the aim of all
other souls still struggling on the road. But manifestly further aphorisms
upon that would be out of place, as well as being such as could not be
understood, to say nothing of the uselessness of giving them. "

-----------------------------------------------------


Interesting concepts and paradoxes. Perhaps due to our own continuing
matter-influenced "Lower Mind" currently functioning.. Yet, I sense behind
that, there is a "Superior Mind" that is steady and uninfluenced.

Any ideas ?

Best wishes.

Dallas

=========================================
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Gerald Schueler 
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2005 9:25 PM
To: 
Subject: Maya

"Spirit is matter on the seventh plane; matter is Spirit - on the lowest
point of its cyclic activity; and both-are MAYA. " (HPB)

[DTB What is the source of this CAUSELESS CAUSE ? or some other
reason or is there none for a "SOURCE " ? ]


I can't really make this any clearer than Blavatsky. All seven planes are
maya.

[DTB	Then why do they exist ? ]


Jerry S.