Theos-Talk Archives (June 2005 Message tt00252)

Hallo Perry, Daniel and all,


My views are:

I cannot quite agree with either Perry or Daniel on this.
Try the following and see if not some of the key pieces falls into place.
I runs a few pages - sorry about that.

The piece or article is a newly rewritten excerpt from
chapter 1 in the book "The Sufi Mystery" written by N. P. Archer.
This chapter is in fact very old and was written by a Sufi in the years
11-1300 if my memory serves me well.

The big question is what happened when Blavatsky died ?
Who were or are the later emmisaries and are you one of them ?


Theosophical organisations and their mode of operating



I will start with the ordinary term called - Spiritual Development - or the 
spiritual Seekers journey on the Path of initiation. The spiritual Seeker 
has at the beginning of the journey and somewhat further often the view, 
that Spiritual Development is a journey or a series of journeys, which lead 
to perfection. - There is a Path and a Spiritual Guide. That which often 
confuses the spiritual seeker, is, whether it is literally a journey or a 
metaphorical journey. The truth is both matters are of importance.

The spiritual Seeker often has to take long and exhausting journeys towards 
perfection. There is both an inner and an outer journey to go through. The 
one relates to the body. The other to the mental or the consciousness.

Thereafter the Spiritual Guide comes in to question. A personality, which 
isn't to be worshipped blindly, because that is exactly NOT the idea with 
having a spiritual guide; or teacher.

Such a teacher comes, teaches and guides a group of people at a certain 
place and at a more or less fixed period of time. The teacher offers herself 
or himself by he's or hers presence. Those who are interested have to offer 
themselves as students.

The actual step - to become a student is difficult to make, even so if the 
student believes that he or she really want to learn, - because the student 
has to fight with different kinds of psychological emotional or mental 
blockages - especially fear, doubt, uncertainty, and ignorance. Said with 
psychological ulterior motive - the student wants to learn, but doesn't want 
to give. If the student doesn't want to give the teacher his or hers 
attention, then the student won't be able to learn.

The more down to earth person's minds are these days - in many ways today 
very unstable and capricious. He or she maybe one day want to dabble into 
Spiritual Development (for instance a version of Raja-yoga) and esoterical 
teachings, - and then the next day - going out with friends getting stoned 
in alcohol - is highest on the agenda. And then after a couple of weeks 
Spiritual development is an important again - at least a little.

And most people in these days have a good deal of build in opposition, which 
has to be overcome - before the step can be taken wholly and totally.

It may be that the Seeker has some background of self-development. Sometimes 
this can be a drawback, because it can make him or her think that he/she 
knows more than he/she does. This is showing his/hers lack of humility, and 
lack of recognition of how much one really doesn't know anything about.

In the teachers (here a male) effort to give all he can to the disciple, the 
teacher must reveal himself and his teaching little by little. If he where 
to give his full concentration at too early a stage, the disciple would not 
be able to absorb the teachings. Different aspects of the teacher are seen 
at different times. Some people even think that they see actual faults in 
the teacher. These strangely enough, are generally reflections of the faults 
of the student, which are coming to the surface.

It is in order to place the disciple in a condition in which she/he can 
become accessible to the understanding of truth, by an inner sense, that the 
teacher takes on the burden of the student. He may have to ask for the 
sacrifice of things, which the student prizes the most. This often from good 
reasons, which will be explained, when time is right.

When deprived of the teacher, the student will often be guided by his/hers 
own lower personality ("the commanding self"). A student at such a stage may 
attach to any centre or organisation of attraction, which offers Spiritual 
Development, and which the student finds exciting and interesting etc. This 
is because the student is at a stage where Spiritual Organisations has 
value - or that which the student thinks is Spiritual organisations, - but 
the student hasn't yet developed his/hers sense of discrimination.

This situation may make the half-mature disciple proud, and she/he may set 
himself/herself up as a teacher, especially if the teacher has given him/her 
some authority. This sort of development is responsible for the 
fragmentation of true teachings, and their absorption by pseudo-Theosophical 
organisations, certain New Age Organisations or the like.

A sign of a deteriorated system is when the members seek only mystical 
experience, "openings" or illumination without realising that this, if true, 
will have a certain effect upon them. That is, Spiritual Development without 
opening the heart-centre or the centre for compassion in a proper manner is 
bad, and should be avoided.



Many are the theosophist who has warned against this.



The same goes for Meditation. Meditation gives some sort of calmness. But it 
is a preparatory step, and gives calmness only as a 'signpost'. When the 
calmness has been attained some people become addicted to it, and their 
progress is frozen at that point. They have become meditation-addicts. This 
is like the fat man (or woman), who must eat sugar because he has developed 
a craving for it. Sugar is a means to an end, not an end. For him it has 
become an end. Sugar is food and fuel. For this man it is a shackle on his 
progress, making him heavier and heavier.

The same is true of some of the modern techniques or imitation cults - like 
uncontrolled spiritual dancing or certain forms of psychotherapy - for 
instance people seeking their inner 'release-scream' or where one 'blow of 
steam' etc.

People who take these things up have forgotten, what spiritual development 
really is - i.e. Theosophy (wisdom of the gods, or wisdom of God), to 
produce the perfect being - the God of wisdom within. They are therefore 
only dabbling. They use their experiences to convince themselves that they 
are progressing. Conviction is not a fact.



But, these imitation cults mentioned above could in certain few cases lead 
some people to spiritual heights - but they themselves are only beginner 
manoeuvres.

One often has to learn, what Spiritual Development really is first; I.e. 
Learning How to Learn. Some throws them selves into the first and best they 
can lay their eyes on. Others are thinking more carefully and deeply, and 
find the right method, or what is the right method for them. This happens 
best in groups in this age of information and communication - where a new 
paradigm is shinning more and more bright in the horizon. But also some 
times alone. Being alone or not is a matter of balance.



But also very often - the place, the organisation and the method one as a 
newcomer or lesser experienced Seeker wants or thinks is the best for 
oneself and perhaps even others - is really not so.

They, the newcomers, have a tendency - because of a still remaining egoistic 
fragment in their character - to join those organisations, follow those 
methods, which they them selves feel comfortable about and that with rather 
egoistical motives, whether they are conscious of it or not.

A major reason is often that, what - one really needs to learn - one really 
doesn't know much about. Only the initiate of the higher level knows - 
really knows.

These newcomers are often not aware of, that there are many paths within the 
teachings of Theosophy. (See Blavatsky's view upon it in "The Secret 
Doctrine", II, p.191, footnote).



In the following it could be of interest to keep the history of Theosophy or 
the Wisdom Tradition in mind. One can read about the Theosophical history or 
the history of the Wisdom Tradition as such somewhere on the Internet - by 
searching.



Let us revert to the Spiritual journey. From time to time suitable teachers 
of the Wisdom Tradition has been sent by their Masters or guides to travel 
to a certain place and establish the teaching. Such teachers have an 
influence on various levels.



Those above mentioned Spiritual teachers work has not only been to give 
people Spiritual guidance and education. It has also been to prepare the 
ground for further development of the living progress of the Path of Wisdom.

There are also minor emissaries who are sent out to teach and prepare the 
ground for further development. These people has been known to set 
themselves up as ultimate authorities, because part of their training is to 
test their loyalty to the whole School of Wisdom, which is as generally 
known consisting of one entity.

But, if, a teacher of the Wisdom tradition dies, or there is a gap in the 
teaching, what then? The interesting thing is, that the very gap is a part 
of the training. You may explain certain things to a child : shall we say 
teach her or him not to do certain things. Then you will pretend to go out 
of the house - and observe her or him. According to how well he/she has 
learned, so will he/she react. In this 'absence exercise', precisely the 
same thing happens to the teacher of Wisdom, though many are not conscious 
of it.

And here we can have Blavatsky's life in mind. What can we say happened when 
she died?



After the disappearance from the field of a teacher of Wisdom, the followers 
will divide themselves into groups, in accordance with their strength and 
weaknesses. Some will assume control of others. They may be good or bad, and 
this will be shown by their reaction to - the second teacher - when he/she 
arrives.

If they realise he/she is their teacher, then they have merely been 
developing themselves and can mature. But if they have become atrophied, 
they will be too blind to recognize the Spirituality of the very teacher, 
for which appearance they have been prepared. They may attach themselves, in 
default, to a different group. (And this groups existence is maybe no 
coincidence.) Again well and good : providing they return to the mainstream 
of teaching when it is offered to them again. This is the test of whether 
they have overcome the lower self. They will realise, if they are 
sufficiently developed, that the person who appears to be 'second' teacher 
is in reality - the first in importance.

Life is reversed for the undeveloped man (the newcomer), and he/she will 
behave in accordance with this. The first teacher does not make life easier, 
in most cases, for the generality of disciples. He/She will teach them 
things, which are only of use when the second teacher arrives and reality 
falls into place. The object of this is twofold. In the first place, certain 
valuable thoughts have been given to the disciples. In the second, they are 
tested by the means of these ideas. Just as our western psychologists give 
odd-shaped pieces of wood to people, to see how they put them together, 
teachers of Wisdom will give odd-pieces of material of - mental kind - to 
his/her followers. - If they try to fit these together however, and to make 
a pattern in his/hers - absences, - they are becoming 'fossilised'. Because, 
the Wisdom tradition has to show that the object of mankind is not to 
construct idols, but to follow a supreme pattern, which is learnt piece by 
piece.



Quite obviously the semi-blind among the people, during their 
'waiting-period', will try to work out their own interpretation. They may, 
as have been done in the past, write books to explain what they have 
learned. This is the danger-point, because when a man/woman is accepted as, 
say, a philosopher (of wisdom) because she/he has written a book explaining 
a philosophy, he/she will not readily accept, that she/he only have been 
'fumbling'. He/She has quite possibly become a prisoner of his/hers lower 
self. The self-conceit of the man/woman is now bound up with his/hers 
'creation', the book or the method, which he/she has used to organise the 
fragments, which he/she has. He/she is probably or possibly lost - for the 
cause.

In order to break through this shell of accretions and fossilisations, 
the - second teacher - will tend to act in a different, perhaps in a certain 
dramatically different manner, from the original one. This could happen, to 
break the 'idols', which have been formed out of the thoughts, which were 
originally given.

So very important: The use of ideas is to shape a man or woman, not to 
support a system - which is viewed in a limited manner. This is one way in 
which the Wisdom Tradition is 'living', and not just the perpetuations of 
ideas and movements. This seems important to understand and know about.



When a system of teaching of wisdom is in a period of fallowness, because 
the one who propagated it is dead, then there comes a period of stagnation. 
This period can last between 10 years, 15 years or more. In the time, which 
passes, the group of people who is affected by the system are sieved by 
natural means. Some wander away. Others carry on automatically not really 
knowing, what they are doing. They are now 'frozen', though they do not know 
they are.

The blind may try to lead the blinder. This takes the form of assumption of 
authority by those who were given some sort of authority in the original 
mandate. These are the people in the most dangerous position, because the 
longer they remain 'orphaned' the more strongly their lower self (or the 
three lower bodies) asserts it self.

Others may modify the teachings in a learned and personal way. Some 
certainly fall a prey to cults, which have come into being in order to serve 
them. The people who joins these are at great pains to explain why they 
consider, that they represent the same kind of teaching - and this is 
important. It is important, because it shows the Theosophist or the real 
spiritually minded, very clearly, that the people who try to explain - are 
in fact troubled by conscience. Somewhere inside them, they know, that they 
are identifying themselves with an imitation, or a second-best. But they are 
supported by their lower bodies or lower personality, - and this is too 
strong for them.

Those can be helped by being lead to think in new thinking-patterns and 
systems. It is via the conscience, that one finds the path forward, - 
thereby will be able to remove the limitations of the lower personality.



Imagine a group of people shipwrecked. They think there is no hope of 
rescue. They find a raft, and are glad. After a time more people come along 
in a big boat. But the first people will not leave the raft, because they 
have become used to it. They may have convinced themselves, that it is 
actually a boat. (So it is to some philosophical or religious people today.)

The points at which the mystical traditions, which are still alive, are in 
contact with each other cannot really be explained by the means of books. 
And yet people continue to write books showing how they have found this and 
that point of resemblance.

The truth can only be found by actual experience, - and easier by awareness 
on such aspect as I have touch upon.



To sink ecstasy in Wisdom is better than to sink Wisdom in ecstasy. The 
Wisdom Tradition teaches by several different systems, and not only by 
one, - one book or teen books, BUT also by thousands and thousands of 
books - and the dogmatic ones doesn't want to listen.



- - - - - - -



Any comments from the heart of compassion are welcome.







from

M. Sufilight with peace and love...



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Perry Coles" <perrycoles@yahoo.com>
To: <theos-talk@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 11, 2005 4:40 AM
Subject: Theos-World Re: Konstantin & Vladimir on Claims of Bailey & Roerich


> Hi Daniel and All,
> The point you raised hear, to me is key to the problems that have
> arisen from later claimants who claimed to be giving out `new
> teachings' from the same teachers that Blavatsky was in
> communication with.
> If these teachings are completely contradictory and contrary to what
> was said only relatively a few years earlier, surely this shows us
> that the communications of later claimants came from different
> sources.
>
> This is a simple question of deductive reasoning rather than trying
> to give Blavatsky some kind of dogmatic authority as is claimed or
> inferred by some.
> In examining for veracity of teachings surely consistency is an
> important method to use philosophically.
> If we refuse to examine this kind of important evidence would this
> not be at very least irresponsible at worst philosophically
> dishonest?
>
> If the ability to openly challenge and examine these types of
> inconsistencies is not allowed in theosophical publications we
> really have to ask why and how can this possibly be tolerated
> especially by students in positions who may be able to help to help
> facilitate these type of articles to be published?
>
> This is not to imply at all that the concepts of Blavatsky's
> teachers was right and the latter claiments where wrong, however the
> implications of the inconsistencies does show they came from a
> different source.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Perry
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Daniel H. Caldwell"
> <danielhcaldwell@y...> wrote:
> > The current discussion between Konstantin & Vladimir
> > illustrates the varying opinions about the apparent
> > conflicting claims and teachings of Bailey & Roerich
> > not to mention those of many other claimants including
> > Leadbeater and Besant.
> >
> > With so many conflicting statements by all the persons
> > listed at:
> >
> > http://blavatskyarchives.com/latermessengers.htm#six
> >
> > isn't it prudent that if one accepts (even tentatively)
> > the initial claims and teachings of H.P. Blavatsky it would
> > be advisable to first thoroughly study her claims
> > and teachings BEFORE also adopting some later messenger's
> > claims/teachings.
> >
> > Daniel
> > http://hpb.cc
>
>
>
>
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