Theos-Talk Archives (May 2005 Message tt00642)

Hi Paul,
I think its very true that many things we may at one time to have 
believed to have been virtue turn out to be reptilian survival in 
fancy clothes.

For example to use the JW's a large motivation is fear of Yahwey's 
wrath at Armagedon.
People completely change their lifestyle and "give up" some of their 
vices in order to save their skins from either hell or Gods wrath.

Of course many times motivations are actually mixed and so we can 
only use discernment to try and work out what is genuinely a 
spiritual motivation and what is coming from a fear based reptilian 
survival motivation, maybe it's a bit of both.

Wanting to believe in life after death can also come from this 
motivation.
I think this is why in the east viveka or spiritual discernment 
constantly it is suggested needs to be applied.

As humans at this stage we predominately seem to come some survival 
and fear and so I think this becomes reflected in our institutions 
and belief systems.

While honesty and integrity may be the best policy it is not always 
the easiest one to sustain.
Once again it's the distance between the ideal and the actual.
Things are never black and white there's all the wide variety in 
between as well.

Regards

Perry

--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "kpauljohnson" <kpauljohnson@y...> 
wrote:
> Hey,
> 
> This is an edited repost of a couple of posts I wrote to the ex-
> Baha'i yahoo group which I co-moderate as of last week:
> 
> I've been thinking about the triune brain model
> of McLean:
> http://www.ezls.fb12.uni-siegen.de/mkroedel/paul_maclean.html
> 
> and the idea of memes, originated by Richard Dawkins and developed 
by
> Susan Blackmore:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
> 
> and how they relate to the way religions get hijacked by the most
> destructive human urges despite whatever noble intentions they 
started
> out with. Super powerful memes like DANGER! HERESY! SEX! overpower 
> all other memes in sight because they evoke the reptilian and lower 
> mammalian fight-or-flight response and shut down the higher human 
> neocortex functions of empathy and understanding.
> 
> Since Baha, Jesus, and all other religious founders had triune 
brains,
> they expressed them in messages that address people at multiple
> levels. Unfortunately, no matter how fine the sentiments and ideals
> that come out of their neocortexes, if they mixed those up with
> virulent, or violent messages from (and to others') reptilian and 
> lower mammalian brains, the bad will tend to overpower the good 
> whenever the believer is under stress.
> 
> Therefore, unless "destroy the unbeliever, torture the heretic" is
> explicitly and repeatedly rejected (as in Buddhism and Jainism) 
those
> destructive memes are lying in wait and can at any moment hijack the
> consciousness of any believer confronted with a challenge to his/her
> comfort and sense of security.
> 
> Christianity has the virtue of at least allowing for multivocality, 
> starting with the divergent gospels. People understand that there 
are 
> multiple POVs and express that in different faith communities. But 
> even in the seemingly peaceable and openminded ranks of e.g. 
Quakers 
> and Unitarians, there is the exclusivist vs. universalist tension 
> which I equate with the lower and higher brain. (The ARE came to 
the 
> brink of disaster over this issue in 2000.)
> 
> Baha'i is clearly an example of a body of teachings that speak at
> different levels, and in the mid-90s after encountering Juan Cole, 
the
> Walbridges et al I thought "Wow, there is so much more depth and
> subtlety to this body of literature than I ever realized when I was 
a
> Baha'i-- this is not so bad after all." But it wasn't long before I
> recognized that the House and its devoted disciples were 
relentlessly
> focused at the lower mammalian and reptilian levels. All 
the "consort 
> with all" sentiment was window dressing and the bottom line was 
> breathless anticipation of the impending calamitous destruction of 
> the unbelievers. It's all really about "us vs. them"; JWs wearing 
the 
> masks of UUs, IMO. If Baha was really anything *approaching* 
what/who 
> he said he was, he would have foreseen the disastrous consequences 
of 
> his hatemongering language and softened it. And would have 
repudiated 
> and denounced the evil Bab. (Like you, I won't call Baha'u'llah 
evil. 
> But have no such reticence about the Bab-- maybe it's because I'm a 
> librarian but this business of burning of unbeliever books is way 
way 
> over the top, irredeemable.)
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Paul
> 
> PS-- Mixed messages in the Theosophical literature, and member 
> responses, are also usefully understood in terms of the triune 
brain 
> and memes.