Theos-Talk Archives (March 2005 Message tt00446)

Mar 21 2005

Dear Estela

You ask:

"Can someone help the newcomers by outlining the seven states of 
consciousness and the seven planes of Nature.

Geoffrey speaks of a discarnate existence in the after-death states. Then, 
are we aware of existing when we are in the after-death state? Do we have a 
sense of individuality, not ego, but a sense of being? We do not retain a 
body, but do we retain a mind?"

-----------------------------------------------------------

1

Concerning the 7 "Principles of Man and Nature" you may find them enumerated
by H P B in the SECRET DOCTRINE on pages S D Vol. 1 157-8, and II 596.


===================================================

Seven-fold Man and His Vehicles in States of Consciousness

=============================================================
Classification in	Vedantic
Classification in
"Esoteric Buddhism"	Classification	Taraka Raja Yoga
================================================================
1 Sthula Sarira	.	. Annamaya Kosa	+ 
[Food made | |
body]	| Sthulopadhi 
|	[ Jagrat ]
2	Prana (Life)	.	+	|	[ awake in
the
| Pranamaya Kosa	|	body ]
| [Sutratma]	+
3	Vehicle of Prana	|
Linga Sarira or	|				
Astral body	+			
							
4	Kama Rupa	.				
	

Volitions and	+
Manomaya Kosa	| Sukshmopadhi
Feelings	[Mind Sheath]	|
[Swapna]
the dream state	|	dreaming
|
5	Mind |	|	
Vignanam	Vignanamaya Kosa	+	 
[Knowledge]					  
							
6	Spiritual Soul	. Anandamaya Kosa	Karanopadhi
(Buddhi)	[Contemplative,	[ Sushupti]
[blissful state]	[
deep sleep ]
							
7	Atma	.	.	. Atma .	. Atma
[ Turiya ]
[Upeksha]
Profound
Spiritual

	
Mediation

[ From: SD I p 157]


===================================================

Correspondence of the 7 Cosmic and 7 Human "principles."


======================================================
Human aspects or	Cosmic aspects or
Principles	Principles
======================================================


TRIPLE ASPECT OF THE DEITY


1.	Universal Spirit (Atma)	The Unmanifested Logos

2.	Spiritual Soul (Buddhi)	Universal (latent) Ideation
(see Fnote p. 597)

3.	Human Soul, Mind (Manas)	Universal (or Cosmic) active
Intelligence


SPIRIT OF THE EARTH



4.	Animal Soul (Kama-Rupa)	Cosmic Chaotic energy

5.	Astral Body (Linga-Sarira)	Astral Ideation, reflecting 
terrestrial things.

6.	Life Essence (Prana)	Life Essence or Energy

7.	Body (Sthula Sarira)	The Earth.
[ from: SD II 596]

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------

Table From: Secret Doctrine I p. 157

==============================================================


=============================================

Additionally here is a review on this subject:


SEVEN-FOLD MAN


Nearly everyone says he has a soul and a body, and there it ends. What the
soul is, and whether it is the real person or whether it has any powers of
its own, are not inquired into, the preachers usually confining themselves
to its salvation or damnation. And by thus talking of it as something
different from oneself, the people have acquired an underlying notion that
they are not souls because the soul may be lost by them. From this has come
about a tendency to materialism causing men to pay more attention to the
body than to the soul, the latter being left to the tender mercies of the
priest of the Roman Catholics, and among dissenters the care of it is most
frequently put off to the dying day. But when the true teaching is known it
will be seen that the care of the soul, which is the Self, is a vital matter
requiring attention every day, and not to be deferred without grievous
injury resulting to the whole man, both soul and body.. 


THE 7-FOLD CLASSIFICATION

H. P. Blavatsky directly from the Great Lodge of Initiates.places.the old
doctrine [of seven-fold Man] before western civilization. The
classification is: 

1.	The Body, or Rupa. 
2.	Vitality, or Prana-Jiva. 
3.	Astral Body, or Linga-Sarira. 
4.	Animal Soul, or Kama-Rupa 
5.	Human Soul, or Manas. 
6.	Spiritual Soul, or Buddhi. 
7.	Spirit, or Atma, 
	
The words in the Sanskrit language are adopted the English terms. This
classification stands to this day for all practical purposes, but it is
capable of modification and extension.
For instance, a later arrangement which places ASTRAL BODY second instead
of third in the category does not substantially alter it. It at once gives
an idea of what man is, very different from the vague description by the
words "body and soul," and also boldly challenges the materialistic
conception that mind is the product of brain, a portion of the body. 

No claim is made that these principles were hitherto unknown, for they were
all understood in various ways not only by the Hindus but by many Europeans.
Yet the compact presentation of the sevenfold constitution of man in
intimate connection with the septenary constitution of a chain of Globes
through which the being evolves, had not been given out. 

Considering these constituents in another manner, we would say that the
lower man is a composite being, but in his real nature is a unity, or
immortal being, comprising a trinity of Spirit, Discernment, and Mind which
requires four lower mortal instruments or vehicles through which to work in
matter and obtain experience from Nature. 

This trinity is that called Atma-Buddhi-Manas in Sanskrit, difficult terms
to render in English. Atma is Spirit, Buddhi is the highest power of
intellection, that which discerns and judges, and Manas is Mind. This
threefold collection is the real man; and beyond doubt the doctrine is the
origin of the theological one of the trinity of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.
The four lower instruments or vehicles are shown in this table: 


The Real Immortal Man is : 

Atma, 
Buddhi, 	
Manas, 


The transitory Lower Vehicles are : 

.	The Passions and Desires, 
.	Life Principle, 
.	Astral Body, 
.	Physical Body. 

These four lower material constituents are transitory and subject to
disintegration in themselves as well as to separation from each other. When
the hour arrives for their separation to begin, the combination can no
longer be kept up, the physical body dies, the atoms of which each of the
four is composed begin to separate from each other, and the whole collection
being disjointed is no longer fit for one as an instrument for the real man.


DEATH of the PHYSICAL

This is what is called "death" among us mortals, but it is not death for the
real man because he is deathless, persistent, immortal. He is therefore
called the Triad, or indestructible trinity, while they are known as the
Quaternary or mortal four. 

This quaternary or lower man is a product of cosmic or physical laws and
substance. It has been evolved during a lapse of ages, like any other
physical thing, from cosmic substance, and is therefore subject to physical,
physiological, and psychical laws which govern the race of man as a whole.

Hence its period of possible continuance can be calculated just as the limit
of tensile strain among the metals used in bridge building can be deduced by
the engineer. Any one collection in the form of man made up of these
constituents is therefore limited in duration by the laws of the
evolutionary period in which it exists. Just now, that is generally seventy
to one hundred years, but its possible duration is longer. Thus there are in
history instances where ordinary persons have lived to be two hundred years
of age; and by a knowledge of the occult laws of nature the possible limit
of duration may be extended nearly to four hundred years. 


.	THE VISIBLE PHYSICAL MAN IS: 
.	
.	Brain, Nerves, Blood, Bones, Lymph, Muscles, Organs of Sensation and
Action, and Skin. 


.	THE UNSEEN PHYSICAL MAN IS: 
.	
.	Astral Body, Passions and Desires, Life Principle (called prana or
jiva). 
.	
It will be seen that the physical part of our nature is thus extended to a
second department which, though invisible to the physical eye, is
nevertheless material and subject to decay. 


REAL AND UNREAL

Because people in general have been in the habit of admitting to be real
only what they can see with the physical eye, they have at last come to
suppose that the unseen is neither real nor material. But they forgot that
even on the earth plane noxious gases are invisible though real and
powerfully material, and that water may exist in the air held suspended and
invisible until conditions alter and cause its precipitation. 

Let us recapitulate before going into details. The Real Man is the trinity
of Atma-Buddhi-Manas, or Spirit and Mind, and he uses certain agents and
instruments to get in touch with nature in order to know himself. 

These instruments and agents are found in the lower Four -- or the
Quaternary -- each principle in which category is of itself an instrument
for the particular experience belonging to its own field, the body being the
lowest, least important, and most transitory of the whole series. 

For when we arrive at the body on the way down from the Higher Mind, it can
be shown that all of its organs are in themselves senseless and useless when
deprived of the man within. 

Sight, hearing, touch, taste, and smelling do not pertain to the body but to
the second unseen physical man, the real organs for the exercise of those
powers being in the ASTRAL BODY, and those in the physical body being but
the mechanical outer instruments for making the coordination between nature
and the real organs inside. 

[Extracts from THE OCEAN OF THEOSOPHY ]

================================

2

CONCERNING DEVACHANIC CONSCIOUSNESS

[This is quite technical]



HOW IS DEVACHAN CREATED ?

"...we ourselves create our Devachan...while yet on earth, and mostly during
the latter days and even moments of our intellectual sentient lives. That
feeling which is strongest in us at that supreme hour, when as in a dream,
the events of a long life to their minutest detail are marshaled in the
greatest order in a few seconds in our vision, (Fn.:--That vision takes
place when a person is already proclaimed dead. The brain is the last organ
that dies.) that feeling will become the fashioner of our bliss or woe, the
life-principle of our future existence...The real full remembrance of our
lives will come but at the end of the minor cycle,--not before..."
Theos. Articles & Notes, p. 246


"...the highest state permitted to it (personal or animal soul) on earth
being samadhi. It is only its essence that has followed the monad into
Devachan, to serve it there as its ground-tone, or as the background against
which its future dream-life and development will move...That which is in
Devachan is...the smell of the flower...its aroma will never die, and may be
recalled and resurrected ages thence..."	T. A. & N., p 24



WHO GOES TO DEVACHAN


"The personal Ego, of course, but beatified, purified, holy. Every Ego--the
combination of the 6th and 7th principles--which after the period of
unconscious gestation is reborn into the Devachan, is of necessity as
innocent as a new born babe. The fact of his being reborn at all shows the
preponderance of good over evil in his old personality...he brings along
with him but the Karma of his good deeds, words, and thoughts into this
Devachan...all those who have not slipped down into the mire of unredeemable
sin and bestiality go to the Devachan...Meanwhile they are rewarded;
receive the effects of the causes produced by them."	Theos. Art. & Notes,
p. 244-5



WHAT IS CONSCIOUS IN DEVACHAN ?


"As to the personal Soul--by which we mean the spark of consciousness that
preserves in the Spiritual Ego the idea of the personal "I" of the last
incarnation--this lasts, as a separate distinct recollection, only
throughout the Devachanic period; after which time it is added to the
innumerable incarnations of the Ego... Immortality is but one's unbroken
consciousness; and the personal consciousness can hardly last longer than
the personality itself...and such consciousness...survives only throughout
Devachan, after which it is reabsorbed, first, in the individual, and then
in the universal consciousness."	Key 107-8


["Manas...the Ego"] ..."It has not forgotten them [deeds in past lives]
...it knows and remembers its misdeeds as well as you remember what you have
done yesterday."	Key 136



PRINCIPLES ACTIVE & CONSCIOUSNESS IN DEVACHAN


"...the physiologist rejects a priori WILL, the chief and indispensable
factor of the inner man. He refuses to recognize it apart from particular
acts of volition, and declares that he known only the latter, viewed by him
simply as a reaction or desire of determination of energy outward...Hence
the physiologist would have to reject at once the possibility of
consciousness--minus memory..."	T A & N p. 20


"Unfettered from the personal sensations of the manas, the devachanic
consciousness would certainly have to become universal or absolute
consciousness, with no past as with no future, the two merging into one
eternal PRESENT--but for the trammels of the personal Ego...the ethereal
atoms that act in the spiritual consciousness of the monad, during its bliss
wholly based and depending upon the degree of its connections with only the
essence of the personal Ego."	T A & N p. 20


"...the spiritual consciousness...sense pertaining to the immutable can
never sleep of even be dormant per se, and is always in the "Light" of
reality [ enables the occultist ] to perceive that reality in the subjective
world which was hidden from it in waking hours..."	T A & N, p.
21


"...the participations of the manas in the Devachanic bliss...takes away
from, the reality that would fall to the lot of the monad were it altogether
free from its presence. Its bliss is an outcome of...the delusion or
"heresy of individuality," which...together with the...chain of causes, is
necessary for the monad's future birth...all this leads the occultist to
regard the association of "intercourse" between two disembodied entities in
the Devachan...as an illusion..."	T A & N, p. 21

	

BASIS FOR DEVACHANIC "DREAM"


[The force of unfinished mental work]... "an intense and purely spiritual
passion for intellectual pursuit," is called "an unsatisfied yearning which
must exhaust itself before the entity can move on to the purely a-rupa
(formless-impersonal) condition. A provision is made for every case, and,
in each case it is created by the dying man's last, uppermost desire..."
[not "thought"]	Theos. Art. & Notes, p. 32


"Life in Devachan is the function of the aspirations of earth life; not the
indefinite prolongation of that "single instant," but its infinite
developments, the various incidents and events based upon and outflowing
from that one "single moment" or moments."	Key 162	



DEATH VISION - A REVIEW OF THE LAST LIFE LIVED


"At the solemn moment of death every man, even when death is sudden, sees
the whole of his past life marshaled before him, in its minutest details.
For one short instant the personal becomes one with the individual and the
all-knowing Ego. But that instant is enough to show him the whole chain of
causes which have been at work during his life. He sees and now understands
himself as he is, unadorned by flattery or self-deception. He reads his
life, remaining as a spectator looking down into the arena he is quitting;
he feels and knows the justice of all the suffering that has overtaken him."
Key 162


"Life in Devachan is the function of the aspirations of earth life; not the
indefinite prolongation of that "single instant," but its infinite
developments, the various incidents and events based upon and outflowing
from that one "single moment" or moments."	Key 162


"The last series of powerful and deeply imprinted thoughts are those which
give color and trend to the whole life in devachan. The last moment will
color each subsequent moment. On those the soul and mind fix themselves and
weave of them a whole set of events and experiences. expanding them to their
highest limit, carrying out all that was not possible in life."
Ocean, p. 113


"Occult Science teaches that the frame of mind in which a man dies, is of
the utmost importance owing to the abnormal and psychic state in which he
then is. The last thought of a dying person does much to influence his
immediate future. The arrow is ready to fly from the bow; the bow-string
is abreast of the ear, and the aim will decide the immediate fate of the
arrow. Happy is he for whom "Om" is the bow, the Self is the arrow and
Brahman--its aim!" At such a sacred moment, strong spiritual aspirations,
whether natural or induced by the earnest exhortations of either one who has
a true conviction, or better still, of one possessed of the divine Gnosis,
will protect the Soul of him who is leaving life...at death we shall be
judged by our own Higher Self, and, under the conduct of the agents of the
Karmic Law (the Demiurgos collectively), will have to reincarnate again into
the prison of the Body, until the past evil Karma has been exhausted. For
until the last farthing of the Karmic debt is exhausted, we can never be
untied from the wheel of "Sansara."  
-Footnote by HPB--	Lucifer, Vol. 8, p. 127-8


"That flash of memory which is traditionally supposed to show a drowning man
every long-forgotten scene of his mortal life--as the landscape is revealed
to the traveler by intermittent flashes of lightning--is simply the sudden
glimpse which the struggling soul gets into the silent galleries where his
history is depicted in imperishable colors."	Isis I 179


"When the frame is cold and eyes closed, all the forces of the body and mind
rush through the brain, and by a series of pictures the whole life just
ended is imprinted indelibly on the inner man not only in a general outline
but down to the smallest detail of even the most intimate and fleeting
impression."	Ocean, p. 97


"That feeling which is strongest in us at that supreme hour, when as in a
dream, the events of a long life to their minutest detail are marshaled in
the greatest order in a few seconds in our vision, (Fn.:--That vision takes
place when a person is already proclaimed dead. The brain is the last organ
that dies.) that feeling will become the fashioner of our bliss or woe, the
life-principle of our future existence...The real full remembrance of our
lives will come but at the end of the minor cycle,--not before..."	T A
& N, p. 246


"That particular one moment which will be most intense and uppermost in the
thoughts of the dying brain at the moment of dissolution, will regulate all
subsequent moments. The moment thus selected becomes the key-note of the
whole harmony, around which cluster in endless variety all the aspirations
and desires which in connection with that moment had ever crossed the
dreamer's brain during his lifetime, without being realized on earth,--the
theme modeling itself on, and taking shape from, that group of desires which
was most intense during life."	THEOS. ART. & NOTES., p. 242



DO NOT DISTURB THE DYING 


"No man dies insane or unconscious--as some physiologists assert. Even a
madman, or one in a fit of delirium tremens will have his instant of perfect
lucidity at the moment of death, though unable to say so to those
present...speak in whispers...lest you disturb the quiet ripple of thought,
and hinder the busy work of the Past casting on its reflections upon the
veil of the future."	M L 170	



WHERE IS DEVACHAN LOCATED ?


"The center of Devachanic activity cannot be localized...Monads during that
time even when connected with their five Kosas (sheaths or principles) know
neither space nor time, but are diffused throughout the former, are
omnipresent and ubiquitous. Manas in its higher aspect is...-- an eternal
"substance" as well as the Buddhi, the spiritual soul -- when this aspect is
developed; and united with the Soul Manas becomes spiritual
self-consciousness, which is a...production of its original "producer"
Buddhi...Thus the higher human triad, drawn by its affinity to those triads
it loved most, with Manas in its highest aspect of self-consciousness --
(which is entirely disconnected with, and has no need as a channel of the
internal organ of physical sense called antah-karana) -- helping, it is ever
associated with, and enjoys the presence of all those it loves--in death as
much as it did in life."	T A & N, p. 22


"...the highest state permitted to it (personal or animal soul) on earth
being samadhi. It is only its essence that has followed the monad into
Devachan, to serve it there as its ground-tone, or as the background against
which its future dream-life and development will move...That which is in
Devachan is...the smell of the flower...its aroma will never die, and may be
recalled and resurrected ages thence..."	T. A. & N., p 24



DEVACHANIC REST AND RECUPERATION


"Devachan...is--a blissful rest, a heavenly oasis during the laborious
journey of the Monad toward a higher evolution...One has to sense
intuitionally its logical necessity; to perceive in it, untaught and
unguided, the outcome and perpetuation of that strictest justice absolutely
consonant with the harmony of the universal law...(27) The bliss of a
Devachanee is complete..."	T. A. & N., p. 26-7

	
	
REASON FOR DEVACHANIC EXPERIENCE


"The 'dream of Devachan' lasts until Karma is satisfied in that direction.
In Devachan there is a gradual exhaustion of force..."The stay in D- is
proportionate to the unexhausted psychic [ spiritual and of the nature of
the soul ] impulses originating in earth life. Those whose attractions were
preponderatingly material will be sooner brought back into rebirth by the
force of Tanha...In such a case the average rule has no application, since
the whole effect either way is due to a balancing of forces and is the
outcome of action and reaction." T. A. & N p.249



BENEVOLENCE IN EARTH LIFE & STAY IN DEVACHAN


"The stay in Devachan is proportionate to the unexhausted psychic impulses
originating in earth life. Those whose attractions were preponderatingly
material will sooner be drawn back into rebirth by the force of Tanha."	T.
A. & N., p. 243-4


"The reward provided by nature for men who are benevolent in a large,
systematic way, and who have not focused their affections on an individual
or specialty, is that if pure they pass the quicker for that thro' the Kama
and Rupa lokas into the higher sphere of Tribuvana, since it is one where
the formulation of abstract ideas and the consideration of general
principles fill the thought of its occupant."	THEOS. A. & N., p.
244	



DREAMS: IN AND OUT OF DEVACHAN


"...Devachan being "but a dream," we should agree upon a definition of the
phenomena of dreams...(20)the Occultist [states] there is a difference
between a dream produced by outward physiological causes and the one which
reacts and becomes in its turn the producer of super-sensuous perceptions
and feelings...he divides dream into the phenomenal and the noumenal...the
physiologist is entirely unfit to comprehend the ultimate constitution of a
disembodied Ego--hence the nature of its "dreams."
T A & N pp. 19-20


"The Devachanic condition in all its aspects is no doubt similar to a dreamy
state when considered from the standpoint of our present objective
consciousness when we are in our waking condition. Nevertheless it is real
to the Devachanee himself as our waking state is to us... A monad in
Devachan has but one state of consciousness, and the contrast between a
waking state and a dreamy state is never presented to it so long as it is in
that condition."	T. A. & N., p. 24


====================================

SPIRITUALISTIC PHENOMENA


Astral Body after Death

So when the body dies the astral man is released, and as at death the
immortal man -- the Triad -- flies away to another state, the astral becomes
a shell of the once living man and requires time to dissipate. It retains
all the memories of the life lived by the man, and thus reflexly and
automatically can repeat what the dead man knew, said, thought, and saw. It
remains near the deserted physical body nearly all the time until that is
completely dissipated, for it has to go through its own process of dying. It
may become visible under certain conditions. 


Astral Ghost or Spook can be Evoked, Materialized

It is the spook of the spiritualistic seance-rooms, and is there made to
masquerade as the real spirit of this or that individual. Attracted by the
thoughts of the medium and the sitters, it vaguely flutters where they are,
and then is galvanized into a factitious life by a whole host of elemental
forces, and by the active astral body of the medium who is holding the
seance or of any other medium in the audience. 


Photographic Projection of Memories of last Life

>From it (as from a photograph) are then reflected into the medium's brain
all the boasted evidences which spiritualists claim go to prove identity of
deceased friend or relative. These evidences are accepted as proof that the
spirit of the deceased is present, because neither mediums nor sitters are
acquainted with the laws governing their own nature, nor with the
constitution, power, and function of astral matter and astral man. 

The Theosophical philosophy does not deny the facts proven in spiritualistic
seances, but it gives an explanation of them wholly opposed to that of the
spiritualists. And surely the utter absence of any logical scientific
explanation by these so-called spirits of the phenomena they are said to
produce supports the contention that they have no knowledge to impart. They
can merely cause certain phenomena; the examination of those and deductions
therefrom can only be properly carried on by a trained brain guided by a
living trinity of spirit, soul, and mind. And here another class of
spiritualistic phenomena requires brief notice. That is the appearance of
what is called a "materialized spirit." 


Materialized Spirit

Three explanations are offered: 

First, that the astral body of the living medium detaches itself from its
corpus and assumes the appearance of the so-called spirit; for one of the
properties of the astral matter is capacity to reflect an image existing
unseen in ether. 

Second, the actual astral shell of the deceased -- wholly devoid of his or
her spirit and conscience -- becomes visible and tangible when the condition
of air and ether is such as to so alter the vibration of the molecules of
the astral shell that it may become visible. The phenomena of density and
apparent weight are explained by other laws. 

Third, an unseen mass of electrical and magnetic matter is collected, and
upon it is reflected out of the astral light a picture of any desired person
either dead or living. This is taken to be the "spirit" of such persons, but
it is not, and has been justly called by H. P. Blavatsky a "psychological
fraud," because it pretends to be what it is not. And, strange to say, this
very explanation of materializations has been given by a "spirit" at a
regular seance, but has never been accepted by the spiritualists just
because it upsets their notion of the return of the spirits of deceased
persons. 

Finally, the astral body will explain nearly all the strange psychical
things happening in daily life and in dealings with genuine mediums; it
shows what an apparition may be and the possibility of such being seen, and
thus prevents the scientific doubter from violating good sense by asserting
you did not see what you know you have seen; it removes superstition by
showing the real nature of these phenomena, and destroys the unreasonable
fear of the unknown which makes a man afraid to see a "ghost." By it also we
can explain the apportation of objects without physical contact, for the
astral hand may be extruded and made to take hold of an object, drawing it
in toward the body. When this is shown to be possible, then travelers will
not be laughed at who tell of seeing the Hindu yogee make coffee cups fly
through the air and distant objects approach apparently of their own accord
untouched by him or anyone else. 

================================================

Best wishes, 

Dallas

===============================================
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Estela 
Sent: Saturday, March 19, 2005 2:22 PM
To: 
Subject: [bn-study] Deity Cosmos and Man, Chapter 2 pg 16 &17


Hello Folks,

9. After-Death States...

The preceding section states that in the life of man there are alternating 
periods of activity and rest, or, more precisely, periods of incarnation - 
that is, life in a body of flesh - alternating with periods of discarnate 
existence, analogous to the twenty-four hour cycle of wakefulness and 
sleep. ....

10. The Nature of Spiritualistic Phenomena...

Much confusion is caused by the ignorant association of the word 
"spiritualistic' with the word "spiritual." What are commonly called 
spiritualistic phenomena are in fact psychic phenomena, that is, phenomena 
explicable in terms of the lower levels of the next plane, little removed 
from the physical world perceived by the ordinary senses. ...

___________________________________--

...outlining the seven states of consciousness and the seven planes of
Nature.

...discarnate existence in the after-death states. Then, 
are we aware of existing when we are in the after-death state? Do we have a 
sense of individuality, not ego, but a sense of being? We do not retain a 
body, but do we retain a mind?

Best regard,

Estela