Theos-Talk Archives (February 2005 Message tt00011)

Feb 1 2005

Dear Friend:

How about saying we are all the SOME in spirituality, but DIFFERENT in
personality ?

Look at this:


THE COMPLEX NATURE OF MANAS

Key, p. 183.
   
" ENQUIRER. But you wanted to tell me something of the essential nature of
Manas, and of the relation in which the Skandhas of physical man stand to
it? 
 
THEOSOPHIST. It is this nature, mysterious, Protean, beyond any grasp,
and almost shadowy in its correlations with the other principles, that is
most difficult to realise, and still more so to explain. 
   
Manas is a "principle," and yet it is an "Entity" and individuality or
Ego. He is a "God," and yet he is doomed to an endless cycle of
incarnations, for each of which he is made responsible, and for each of
which he has to suffer. 
   
All this seems as contradictory as it is puzzling; nevertheless, there
are hundreds of people, even in Europe, who realise all this perfectly, for
they comprehend the Ego not only in its integrity but in its many aspects.
Finally, if I would make myself comprehensible, I must begin by the
beginning and give you the genealogy of this Ego in a few lines. 
 
ENQUIRER. Say on. 
 
THEOSOPHIST. Try to imagine a "Spirit," a celestial Being, whether we
call it by one name or another, divine in its essential nature, yet not pure
enough to be one with the ALL, and having, in order to achieve this, to so
purify its nature as to finally gain that goal. It can do so only by passing
individually and personally, i. e., spiritually and physically, through
every experience and feeling that exists in the manifold or differentiated
Universe. It has, therefore, after having gained such experience in the
lower kingdoms, and having ascended higher and still higher with every rung
on the ladder of being, to pass through every experience on the human
planes. 
   
In its very essence it is THOUGHT, and is, therefore, called in its
plurality Manasa putra, "the Sons of the (Universal) mind." This
individualised "Thought" is what we Theosophists call the real EGO, the
thinking Entity imprisoned in a case of flesh and bones. 
   
This is surely a Spiritual Entity, not Matter, and such Entities are the
incarnating EGOS that inform the bundle of animal matter called mankind, and
whose names are Manasa or "Minds." 
   
But once imprisoned, or incarnate, their essence becomes dual: that is to
say, the rays of the eternal divine Mind, considered as individual entities,
assume a two-fold attribute which is 
   
(a) their essential inherent characteristic, heaven-aspiring mind (higher
Manas), and 
   
(b) the human quality of thinking, or animal cogitation, rationalised
owing to the superiority of the human brain, the Kama-tending or lower
Manas. 
   
One gravitates toward Buddhi, the other, tending downward, to the seat of
passions and animal desires. The latter have no room in Devachan, nor can
they associate with the divine triad which ascends as ONE into mental bliss.
Yet it is the Ego, the Manasic Entity, which is held responsible for all the
sins of the lower attributes, just as a parent is answerable for the
transgressions of his child, so long as the latter remains irresponsible. 
 
ENQUIRER. Is this "child" the "personality"? 
 
THEOSOPHIST. It is. When, therefore, it is stated that the "personality"
dies with the body it does not state all. The body, which was only the
objective symbol of Mr. A. or Mrs. B., fades away with all its material
Skandhas, which are the visible expressions thereof. But all that which
constituted during life the spiritual bundle of experiences, the noblest
aspirations, undying affections, and unselfish nature of Mr. A. or Mrs. B.
clings for the time of the Devachanic period to the EGO, which is identified
with the spiritual portion of that terrestrial Entity, now passed away out
of sight. 
   
The ACTOR is so imbued with the role just played by him that he dreams of
it during the whole Devachanic night, which vision continues till the hour
strikes for him to return to the stage of life to enact another part. 

Also:


Key p. 91


THE SEPTENARY NATURE OF MAN. 

ENQUIRER. Is it what we call Spirit and Soul, and the man of flesh? 
 
THEOSOPHIST. It is not. That is the old Platonic division. Plato was an
Initiate, and therefore could not go into forbidden details; but he who is
acquainted with the archaic doctrine finds the seven in Plato's various
combinations of Soul and Spirit. He regarded man as constituted of two parts
-- one eternal, formed of the same essence as the Absoluteness, the other
mortal and corruptible, deriving its constituent parts from the minor
"created" Gods. Man is composed, he shows, of (1) A mortal
91
   
body, (2) An immortal principle, and (3) A "separate mortal kind of
Soul." It is that which we respectively call the physical man, the Spiritual
Soul or Spirit, and the animal Soul (the Nous and psuche). This is the
division adopted by Paul, another Initiate, who maintains that there is a
psychical body which is sown in the corruptible (astral soul or body), and a
spiritual body that is raised in incorruptible substance. Even James (iii.
15) corroborates the same by saying that the "wisdom" (of our lower soul)
descendeth not from the above, but is terrestrial ("psychical,"
"demoniacal," vide Greek text); while the other is heavenly wisdom. Now so
plain is it that Plato and even Pythagoras, while speaking but of three
"principles," give them seven separate functions, in their various
combinations, that if we contrast our teachings this will become quite
plain. Let us take a cursory view of these seven aspects by drawing two
tables. 
 
THEOSOPHICAL DIVISION


  LOWER QUATERNARY

SANSCRIT TERMS
EXOTERIC MEANING
EXPLANATORY

a. Rupa, or Sthula-Sarira
  
b. Prana
 
c. Linga Sharira
  
d. Kama rupa 
 
----------------------------------------

a. Physical body
  
b. Life, or Vital principle
  
c. Astral body
  
d. The seat of animal desires and passions 

-----------------------------------------------------

a. Is the vehicle of all the other "principles" during life.
  
b. Necessary only to a, c, d, and the functions of the lower Manas, which
embrace all those limited to the (physical) brain.
  
c. The Double, the phantom body.
  
d. This is the centre of the animal man, where lies the line of demarcation
which separates the mortal man from the immortal entity. 

 ===============================
   
 THE UPPER IMPERISHABLE TRIAD.
   
   
SANSCRIT TERMS
EXOTERIC MEANING
EXPLANATORY

e. Manas— a dual principle
in its functions.
  
f.  Buddhi  
 
g.  Atma 

---------------------------------------------
  
e. Mind, Intelligence:
which is the higher  
human mind, whose
light, or radiation 
 links the MONAD, for
the lifetime, to the
 mortal man. 

-----------------------------------------
  
f. The Spiritual Soul 

------------------------------------------
  
g. Spirit  

============================

e. The future state and the
 Karmic destiny of man
depend on whether Manas
gravitates more downward
to Kama rupa, the seat of
 the animal passions, or up-
wards to Buddhi, the
Spiritual Ego. In the
latter case, the higher con-
sciousness of the individual
 Spiritual aspirations of
mind (Manas), assimilating
Buddhi, are absorbed by it
and form the Ego, which
 goes into Devachanic
 bliss.*

  
f. The vehicle of pure universal spirit.

  
g. One with the Absolute, as
its radiation. 


======================================


 Now what does Plato teach? He speaks of the interior man as constituted of
two parts— one immutable and always the same, formed of the same substance
as Deity, and the other mortal and corruptible. These "two parts" are found
in our upper Triad, and the lower Quaternary (vide Table). He explains that
when the Soul, psuche, "allies herself to the Nous
   
*In Mr. Sinnett's "Esoteric Buddhism" d, e, and f, are respectively called
the Animal, the Human, and the Spiritual Souls, which answers as well.
Though the principles in Esoteric Buddhism are numbered, this is, strictly
speaking, useless. The dual Monad alone (Atma-Buddhi) is susceptible of
being thought of as the two highest numbers (the 6th and 7th). As to all
others, since that "principle" only which is predominant in man has to be
considered as the first and foremost, no numeration is possible as a general
rule. In some men it is the higher Intelligence (Manas or the 5th) which
dominates the rest; in others the Animal Soul (Kama-rupa) that reigns
supreme, exhibiting the most bestial instincts, etc. (divine spirit or
substance)*, she does everything aright and felicitously"; but the case is
otherwise when she attaches herself to Anoia, (folly, or the irrational
animal Soul). Here, then, we have Manas (or the Soul in general) in its two
aspects: when attaching itself to Anoia (our Kama rupa, or the "Animal Soul"
in "Esoteric Buddhism,") it runs towards entire annihilation, as far as the
personal Ego is concerned; when allying itself to the Nous (Atma-Buddhi) it
merges into the immortal, imperishable Ego, and then its spiritual
consciousness of the personal that was, becomes immortal. 
 
THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN SOUL AND SPIRIT 

ENQUIRER. Do you really teach, as you are accused of doing by some
Spiritualists and French Spiritists, the annihilation of every personality? 
 
THEOSOPHIST. We do not. But as this question of the duality— the
individuality of the Divine Ego, and the personality of the human animal—
involves that of the possibility of the real immortal Ego appearing in
Seance rooms as a "materialised spirit," which we deny as already explained,
our opponents have started the nonsensical charge.
 
* Paul calls Plato's Nous "Spirit"; but as this spirit is "substance,"
then, of course, Buddhi and not Atma is meant, as the latter cannot
philosophically be called "substance" under any circumstance. We include
Atma among the human "principles" in order not to create additional
confusion. In reality it is no "human" but the universal absolute principle
of which Buddhi, the Soul-Spirit, is the carrier.
 
 ENQUIRER. You have just spoken of psuche running towards its entire
annihilation if it attaches itself to Anoia. What did Plato, and do you mean
by this? 
 
THEOSOPHIST. The entire annihilation of the personal consciousness, as an
exceptional and rare case, I think. The general and almost invariable rule
is the merging of the personal into the individual or immortal consciousness
of the Ego, a transformation or a divine transfiguration, and the entire
annihilation only of the lower quaternary . Would you expect the man of
flesh, or the temporary personality, his shadow, the "astral," his animal
instincts and even physical life, to survive with the "spiritual EGO" and
become sempiternal? Naturally all this ceases to exist, either at, or soon
after corporeal death. It becomes in time entirely disintegrated and
disappears from view, being annihilated as a whole. "
-----------------------------

Best wishes,


Dallas

==================

-----Original Message-----
From: M. Sufilight  
Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2005 7:54 AM
To: 
Subject: Re: Beyond Causal Explan.

My views are
 
I would rather say, that we are all different.
We have developed to different levels of knowledge and wisdom of the
spiritual heart.

Some think they know, that what others talk about is below them. Others know
it.

And yet others do not know it - even if they think they do.
 
What some of us needs right now in our life so to make spiritual progress is
not what another group needs. There is more than a few levels of
spirituality.
 
And what some of you think you need is not what you need,
but what you want or desire.
 
The Teacher knows what you need spiritually.
And it is quite often not what you think it is.
 
Some of you think that you are real spiritual Teachers.
Some of you know, that you are not.
Some of you do not realise how much you delude yourselves.
 
CUT