Theos-Talk Archives (January 2005 Message tt00358)

Hi Bill
What I am saying is that until I can proove the existence of the Masters for myself I will take HPB's word for it.

The older I get the more I am realising that there are many intellectuals out there but very few men of higher intelligence, I do not regard specialists who practice in one particular field as more intelligent than me, more specialised in that aspect of their development maybe, but we (generally speaking) are all capable of learning what they have been taught, if the environment is there and a willingness to apply the brain to the work. Higher Intelligence IMO is an intelligence that has outstripped matter, that I don't have, and that is what I believe the great teachers have and who have passed this knowledge (intelligence) to us.

Are you saying that you do not believe in the Masters until you can prove their existence for yourself? Which, I believe is a valid conclusion. I like to imagine that there are perfected beings out there, so that inspirationally I can attain a higher ideal for myself. For me to imagine something is quite different from believing something.

You say, especially since I have met many higher intelligences than mine in just this lifetime alone. How did you come to this conclusion? It has been my experience that many intellectuals have a way of distancing themselves through specialised language to separate them from the ordinary plebs like you and me. Whereas an intelligent man can speak with a king and a servant so neither feel inferior.


Cass


Bill Meredith <meredith_bill@earthlink.net> wrote:

Hi Cass, you say:
1. HPB says believe nothing, including the SD until you can prove it for 
yourself.
2. I am basing my belief in the Masters on her word and the belief that 
there is a higher intelligence out there than mine.
**************
I understand you to be saying that you have proven for yourself the 
existence of masters even though you are only giving HPB's authority and 
your belief in "higher intelligence out there" as evidence.

Also, I am discussing the concept of the theosophical masters as perfected 
men which to me is a different notion than non-perfect beings with "higher 
intelligence" - especially since I have met many higher intelligences than 
mine in just this lifetime alone.

I agree with you and HPB that we need not believe or disbelieve anything 
until we can prove or disprove it for ourselves. Where I tend to differ 
with you is that I don't accept anyone else's descriptions of perfected men 
as proof that they exist.

If there are any perfected men in the neighborhood reading this, then you 
are certainly invited over to prove yourself, but if I have to believe in 
you before you will prove yourself then thanks, but no thanks.


bill

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cass Silva" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 6:34 PM
Subject: Re: Theos-World Christianity or not...


>
> Dear Bill,
> you said
>
> Personally, I see great similarity between the belief dynamic of a
> theosophist and a christian when it comes to describing an outer
> master.
>
> I say,
> The Christians WC (with Christ) had a living, breathing, walking, talking, 
> miracle making man in a human body, who gave instructions on how to be 
> good at being a man. We on the other hand are groping around in the dark 
> hoping that Perfected Men are out there taking care of our souls and our 
> planet,waiting for signs of their existence to prove our belief in them is 
> grounded in fact not fantasy.
> HPB says believe nothing, including the SD until you can prove it for 
> yourself, I am basing my belief in the Masters on her word, and on the 
> belief that there is a higher intelligence out there than mine.
> Cass
>
>
> Bill Meredith wrote:
>
> My comments was a joke, of course. Sometimes the little emoticon works and
> sometimes not.
>
> But, are you saying that the Master's were perfect in allowing CWL to
> flourish? By asking questions we will learn the masters wisdom in this
> case?
>
>
>
> The theosophical masters select certain people or groups of people to show
> favoritism and special considerations. The theosophical masters (or their
> chiefs) or their chohan actually control the universe through unswerving
> application of The Law.
> The master's say they don't want you to adore them and worship them yet 
> they
> tolerate and even encourage worshipful behavior from theosophists. Why do
> theosophists, even on this list, capitalize Master and Him when referring 
> to
> one of them? It is a worshipful reverence that would be squashed by a true
> master. Those individuals that we might describe as perfected men are our
> brothers not our gods. That it is we with our limited intellect and even
> more limited vision who are daring to judge the perfect being of another
> says volumes about our psychological needs.
>
> Personally, I see great similarity between the belief dynamic of a
> theosophist and a christian when it comes to describing an outer master.
>
> bill
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Cass Silva"
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 7:28 AM
> Subject: Re: Theos-World Christianity or not...
>
>
>
> Dear Bill
> Isnt it by questions that the pupil learns the masters wisdom?
> Cass
>
> Bill Meredith wrote:
>
> DON"T QUESTION THE MASTER'S WISDOM!
>
> :)
>
>
> Bill
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "prmoliveira"
>
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2005 4:37 AM
> Subject: Re: Theos-World Christianity or not...
>
>
>>
>>
>> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, Cass Silva wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> And my question to the group, which has fallen on deaf ears, "why
>> didnt the Master's recognise this pollution in Leadbeaters aura and
>> disassociate him from the TS"? This is a genuine question, I am not
>> out to denounce the Masters, but it is very puzzling to me how
>> perfected men did not prevent this imperfection from flourishing.
>>
>> Perhaps more puzzling is the fact that Leadbeater received letters
>> from one of the Mahatmas (K.H.), was accepted as a Chela (disciple) by
>> him and had his discipleship confirmed in a letter by HPB.
>>
>>
>> Pedro
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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>>
>
>
>
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