Theos-Talk Archives (September 2004 Message tt00440)

Hello Pedro and all,
This is an interesting point and got me looking in dictionary for the 
meaning of antinomy.
I'd never heard that word before.

As the quotes you posted show there is clearly a concept of `faith' 
in theosophical teachings.

I would suggest that this cannot be the blind faith of the religious 
fanatic or based in a fearful mindset of any kind.
Irrational fear can manifest as a need for security and certainty or 
as a need to dominate and control others.

Perhaps the kind of faith spoken about is more an openness and 
receptivity to spiritual (Buddhic) insight that can only come through 
selfless action, we are told.
I think this is why becoming a member of the society only requires a 
sympathy with the 3 objects nothing more.
No idea should be blindly accepted but rather examined and meditated 
upon with as much insight as we have.

The "Mind is the slayer of the Real let the disciple slay the slayer" 
is not therefore a recipe for throwing out logic and reason, 
dogmatic belief and unquestioning obedience would `slay' 
compassionate motive I would suggest and instead become fear based.
Dogmatic belief of scriptures of any kind be they theosophical 
writings , traditional religious ones or scientific ones lead to 
arrogance and a `seperative' mindset I would suggest.

If teachings are presented as just that teachings, we can 
1: blindly believe them that is one mindset. or
2: If we can investigate and explore them with inductive reason and 
our own personal ongoing experience that's another mindset

I subscribe to the second approach.
If the teachings are correct and "true" there "truth" will become 
more apparent in time and as awareness and experience unfolds them.

Living and acting selflessly we are told is the only way that this 
truth (ie:Buddhic) will manifest itself to us.
If my grasp of the subtleties of philosophy is only in the head and 
not acted on in actions of a selfless nature true Buddhi or 
compassion can't be there…yet…
Isn't contradiction, conjecture, debate, paradox, questioning, all 
part of the philosophical and theosophical process.
Can you elaborate more on antinomy and how it relates to theosophical 
teachings I am interested to see your point of view on this.

Cheers
Perry

Quote below from Oxford online dictionary :
http://dictionary.oed.com/


Antinomy -
3. A contradiction between conclusions which seem equally logical, 
reasonable, or necessary; a paradox; intellectual contradictoriness. 
(After Kant.) 
 
1802 H. C. ROBINSON Diary I. 144 The antinomies of pure reason. 
1857 T. WEBB Intell. Locke ix. 175 The imagination was distracted on 
every side by counter inconceivabilities, the Mind was divided 
against itself; Antinomy was its very law. 1877 CAIRD Philos. Kant 
II. xvi. 566 Criticism must discover the nature and extent of the 
antinomies of reason, and must show that they are dogmatically 
insoluble; or that, whichever of the alternative solutions we adopt, 
we are led into absurdity and contradiction.






--- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "prmoliveira" <prmoliveira@y...> 
wrote:
> --- In theos-talk@yahoogroups.com, "Perry Coles" <perrycoles@y...> 
> wrote:
> 
> 
> > I place the same quote from `Key' I placed earlier I think it 
> > explains the situation of theosophical teachings far more clearly 
> > than I can :
> > Keeping in mind the second question on blind faith and how its 
not 
> in 
> > the "theosophical dictionary"
> > This is the key to it never becoming dogma or holy writ.
> 
> 
> > ENQUIRER. And therefore you have implicit faith in them?
> > 
> > THEOSOPHIST. Faith is a word not to be found in theosophical
> > dictionaries: we say knowledge based, on observation and 
experience.
> 
> >We have
> > no two beliefs or hypotheses on the same subject.
> 
> 
> 
> Some examples of 'theosophical antinomy'? Or that truth is indeed 
> a 'many-splendoured thing'?
> 
> 
> "You cannot go to Tibet. I am not the only master there, nor is 
M... 
> Chohan. You must first show that you deserve it by labouring in 
that 
> direction for two or three years. You must be prepared to do 
anything 
> told to you, anything you are ordered through her. If you have 
faith 
> in us — others have not — are you prepared to do all and everything 
> to prove our existence?  
> K.H.
> Approved M."
> (Letters from the Masters of the 
Wisdom, 
> Second Series, letter 49)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> 
> "Thus, C.C.M. could no more than any other escape his fate. He has 
> been tempted and allowed to be deceived by appearances, and to fall 
> but too easily a prey to his weakness — suspicion and lack of self-
> confidence. In short, he is found wanting in the first element of 
> success in a candidate — unshaken faith, once that his conviction 
> rests upon, and has taken root in knowledge, not simple belief in 
> certain facts." 
> 
> (Mahatma Letters, letter 92, 
chronological)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> 
> (Article published in The Theosophist for October 1881. The page 
has 
> marginal comments in K.H.'s writing which are printed here in small 
> bold type parallel with the text of the article, and to which the 
> numbers in brackets refer.)
> 
> "The Talmud says that the souls of those who have not believed in 
> immortality will not become immortal. It is faith only which gives 
> personal immortality (13); science and reason can only affirm the 
> general immortality.
> 
> (13) In the Deva-Chan the Ego sees and feels but that which he 
longed 
> for. He who cares not for a continuation of sentient personal life 
> after physical death will not have it. He will be reborn remaining 
> unconscious as in the transition."
> 
> (ML - Letters from Blavatsky to Sinnett - Appendix I - October 1881)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> 
> "MAHA SAHIB orders me to tell you that according to your faith — 
you 
> will be helped. And why should he have given you his charm were it 
> not that you should be strong and powerful with it?"
> 
> Letter 43 (LMW, Second 
Series)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> "There was a time, when from sea to sea, from the mountains and 
> deserts of the north to the grand woods and downs of Ceylon, there 
> was but one faith, one rallying cry — to save humanity from the 
> miseries of ignorance in the name of Him who taught first the 
> solidarity of all men. How is it now? Where is the grandeur of our 
> people and of the one Truth?"
> 
> (ML 33, chronological)
> 
>                         
> * * *
> 
> 
> "I wish you to assure others T.T, R.A.M., N.N.S., N.D.C., G.N.C., 
> U.U.B., T.V.C., P.V.S., N.B.C., C.S., C.W.L., D.N.G., D.H., S.N.C., 
> etc. among the rest, not forgetting the other true workers in Asia, 
> that the stream of karma is ever flowing on and we as well as they 
> must win our way towards Liberation. There have been sore trials in 
> the past, others await you in the future. May the faith and courage 
> which have supported you hitherto endure to the end."
> 
> (LMW, First Series, to HSO)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> 
> "We cannot alter Karma, my "good friend" or we might lift the 
present 
> cloud from your path. But we do all that is possible in such 
material 
> matters. No darkness can stay for ever. Have hope and faith and we 
> may disperse it. There are not many left true to the "original 
> program"! And you have been taught much and have much that is, and 
> will be, useful."
> 
> (ML 137)
> 
> 
> * * *
> 
> 
> "2) What is the difference between the two kinds of knowledge?
> 
> Real knowledge deals with eternal verities and primal causes. The 
> unreal only with illusory effects.
> 
> Dgyu stands independent of the belief or unbelief of man. Dgyu-mi 
> requires faith — rests on authority."
> 
> (ML - LBS - Appendix II)