Theos-Talk Archives (February 2004 Message tt00125)

Feb 23 2004

Dear Friends:

Re: Living Master -- and Self-knowledge.
Eye and Heart doctrines -- Idealism and Selfishness.

In my understanding:  

Motive relates to the reason why we do anything on a voluntary basis.
Can we impersonally determine what our motives are?  

What tools have we got? How much do we know of our "lower" and our
"higher" natures?  

If there is the possibility of self-knowledge and self-control, then is
not the "controller" wiser, and "superior" to that which is controlled?
Is not the Universal Self (of which we have a "ray" ) superior and the
natural controller of the "lower self?" 

All our motives ought to be overlooked and controlled by the Mind -- the
"Real Actor" who is always "behind the screen" of the physical matter of
our "personality."   

When Mind and the "Real Actor/EGO" work together, we have the
functioning of intuition, and the "Voice of Conscience" prevails.

Gratitude is a feeling of mutual (not exclusive) satisfaction as well as
a recognition of the brotherhood of all spiritual/souls, which
considering themselves as "brothers in eternity," work with and for each
other as a family.
(see S D I 209-10 as an example of what is written in S D I 207-8).
It is the instinctive feeling of reverence for those who are wiser than
we are. We then desire to help and serve Them in their work of
educating others. Promulgation. .

Are there two Egos in Man?  

One (EGO) being universal, impartial, impersonally just and fair to all?
and the (ego, or 'lower self' the other), being intensely selfish,
isolated and demanding of possessions and attention? For how long till
death forces to part with all those things?  

If we consider reincarnation of the spirit /soul as a fact, then the
capacity to understand and to do things is more important that
possessions of any kind. This capacity is what is transferred forward
into a new personality.

We might under this scheme of consideration say that the "Living Master"
is internal to us all the time and represents the IDEAL action. The
application and knowledge of the 7 principles in man gives us the mental
and philosophical tools for this type of understanding. 

When we find an individual who has the bold energy and fearlessness to
exhibit outwardly, at all times, the nature and power of the "Living
interior Master," we find that we respond to it --- and at the same
time, the "lower self" feeling its self threatened reacts to argue
against this and often urges to reject ideal actions. Again, why is
this so? 

There seems to be a constant conflict of personal / ideal going on in
the daily and hourly decision making faculty of each of us. If so, then
why does this happen?

Looking at some more posts made and questions asked. Can we not sense
that this living of ours on the whole, is a kind of School -- a
"testing-ground?" Are we not seeking instinctively and then with
greater assurance to alter our "selfishness" into a generous regard for
all as our brothers? -- to whom a fair share and a just opportunity are
due?  

Lets take an example: If we carefully study what are the records and
ideas attributed in the New Testament to Jesus in THE SERMON ON THE
MOUNT, we may be able to detect these ideals being expressed. Every
great Teacher has expressed the same ideals no matter how far back we
trace. The Brotherhood of all Religions is, for those who study the
beginnings and proceedings, historically of several religions, a
provable, recorded series of facts.  

Dogmas, rituals and priestly assertions have provided since those times,
in each case, the separations between sects, and creeds -- and, also
have provided psychology with the present confusion of idealism and
selfishness. We admire the fearlessness of those who dare to act in an
ideal way.  

But we are still too fearful to completely emulate them. Budha, Krishna,
Pythagoras, Plato, Lao Tse, Patanjali, Confucius, and others have all
pointed to the same ideals as a "path" whereby we can each regulate our
personal desires and passions.

Best wishes,

Dallas

==========================================

-----Original Message-----
From: Zakk Duffany [mailto:zakkduffany@earthlink.net] 
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 5:31 PM
To: study@blavatsky.net
Subject: [bn-study] Re: Living Master

I would like to present a line of thinking in regards to "Thank you". To
start, I would put a definition to Thank you.
It may be defined by various individuals with different understandings
as to
what it means. For the purposes of this
presentation, the definition used will be "Gratitude". It is the feeling
that can cause one to say Thank you. The words
Thank you being the expression of the Gratitude, not the Gratitude
itself.
In this respect, saying Thank you is but
one form of expressing among many. When we speak of that which is self
conscious, there is a Choice of the
expression. We also relate to a Motive as a cause in the expression of
the
Gratitude. But what of that which is
not self conscious? What about that which is called law, a "no choice
reaction or response"? And that which initiates
the reaction or response, but is regarded to have no Motive due to the
lack
of being self conscious? Could that
which has created the universe, knowing the lack of self consciousness
within it, have built gratitude and motive into its
creation, whereby creating the type of laws that exist? Is there a
non-self
conscious type of gratitude and motive which
may be the reflection of the self conscious type? Are we shown gratitude
in
a universal (non - self conscious) way for the
actions we may choose? If so, was there a Motive behind the way the
universal was created? On what scale can
Gratitude or Motive be realized? Much of this seems to depend on one's
definition, on how limited or unlimited that
definition may be and on the magnitude of how it is applied.



----- Original Message -----
From: "peter.m" <snowlion@btopenworld.com>
To: <study@blavatsky.net>
Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2004 2:46 PM
Subject: [bn-study] Re: Living Master


Jerome writes:

>> The Teacher is saying "thank you" every time he "buys-in" on your
karmic
plateau.<<

This seems quite a personality view of the matter - romantic,
sentimental
even.

>> The dharma of the mother and the father is hardly to be compared to
the
river rolling to the sea --- UNLESS that river is a self-conscious
chooser.<<

Agreed about the first part of the above sentence. Perhaps in Ram's and
Gopi's terms, the analogy might be more along the lines that the river
provides a home for those that live in it and are nourished by it. It
does
so without requiring thanks or any special behaviour from its
inhabitants.

As for us humans, when we act out of genuine love for another, perhaps
for
our children, quite often no choice is involved - something more
self-less
responds and just does what needs to be done. No 'thanks', no 'good
deeds',
no knowing smiles are required in return.

Zack writes:
>>> I see the receiving of Thanks being done in a multitude of ways
other
than a verbal word. Receiving Thanks can be the reception of "good
karma".
It can be the feeling of joy when you observe the results of aiding
another. It can be the contentment of performing good works. It can be
the
smile brought to anothers lips. It can be the forwarding of assistance
by an
individual in whom you assisted. The individual is saying Thanks by
repeating the action that was given unto him. <<<

Isn't Karma an impersonal law and the effects we receive the result of
our
own actions, not a way of the universe, or any other wise Being saying
"Thanks". The other statements, the feeling of joy or of contentment
when
you observe the good you have done, seeing the smile on another lips
etc.
These are all very understandable yet are they not more likely to be
responses at the level of personality?

regards,

Peter



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