Theos-Talk Archives (March 2003 Message tt00348)

Sunday, March 16, 2003


Re:	REINCARNATION -- Some answers to Objections


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CHAPTER IX

REINCARNATION CONTINUED

Summary

OBJECTIONS urged.
Desire cannot alter law.
Early arrivals in heaven. Must they wait for us?
Recognition of the soul not dependent on objectivity.
Heredity not an objection.
What heredity does.
Divergences in heredity not recognized.
History goes against heredity.
Reincarnation not unjust.
What is justice?
We do not suffer for another's but for our own deeds.
Memory. Why we do not remember other lives. Who does?
How to account for increase of population.

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Questions


Q. On page 71 is stated, that as we progress in this life, so also
must we progress on leaving it, and s would be unfair to compel the
others to await our arrival in order that we may recognize them. It
seems there is progress after death, more so in fact than during life
in the body ?


A. The context on that page shows that the Teacher is replying to
objections of those who expect to recognize their friends who have
gone before by their physical appearance and general characteristics,
an expectation which is really based upon a stoppage of progress. It
is also known that the Real Man who passes from existence in a body
into other states and returns again from time to time, is really
blending his experiences of any one state with his experiences in
other states and consequently is making progress after death much more
rapidly than bodily conditions could possibly permit. The degree and
kind of progress made depends upon the nature of his thinking during
life, and may be small or great in one direction or another.
Technically speaking, Lower-Manas is the reservoir of the life
thoughts and feelings. Those that are assimilable with Higher Manas
are absorbed and become an addition to Higher Manas; while those that
are of the nature of earth, earthy, remain as tendencies to be met,
and either intensified or transmuted during the succeeding
incarnation. The progress referred to is that of the Higher Ego; the
personality and earth-life is the field wherein the Ego works; after
death, the harvest being garnered, the wheat is separated from the
chaff.


Q. Then there would be no sowing during the after- death states ?

A. The harvest was sown during the earth life last past; during the
life time there was a reaping all the time of causes sown in a
previous life, and during the life being lived; at death, the sum
total of all the thoughts, feelings, desires and tendencies held
during life remain as the basis or cause for the subjective kama-lokic
and devachanic states; the effects of these are then worked out
subjectively, these "effects" of the earth-life becoming then the
"cause" of the "effects" experienced subjectively in the after-death
states. Sowing and reaping in the field of objective existence pro
vides the "seed" for the subjective after-death states, karma
operating continuously in all states.


Q. Then different individuals would have different after-death states,
and have each one his own period between incarnations ?

A. It could not he otherwise; for just as each one's personal
existence in a body differs from every other- is peculiarly his very
own in fact-so the after-death states differ in exact accord with the
life as lived in a body. Some live their lives with much of good and
lit- tie of evil; others with much of evil and little of good, each
one bringing about his own proportion of these; it is the proportion
in each case which determines the period between incarnations. We must
remember in considering these matters that time and space are not the
same subjectively as they are with us in bodies; our days and nights,
months, years and duration of physical existence are governed by the
revolutions of our planet, but in the case of removal from such
conceptions of time, ideas of that and of space differ greatly on the
subjective plane of being. When we are happy, time passes without
notice; when we are miserable, time drags; in both cases the hours of
our mortal time may be the same, but the sense of the procession of
events before our consciousness will make the hours seem fast or slow
according to the state we are in. If we are able while in bodies to
realize such a conception of time while there is everything about us
to remind us of terrestrial time, we should be able to comprehend some
thing of a state where such reminders are entirely absent.


Q. Will a person in his next reincarnation express what he has
assimilated.

A. No one can express what he has not assimilated; that is,-has made a
basis for action. But the question should be amended so as to read
"Individual" instead of "Person". The "personality" is in any one life
but a temporary aspect and action of the Individuality, and differs in
each life, in the environment and in such changes as have been brought
about in previous existences-in character, disposition and under
standing; these may produce in the next incarnation a change of social
relation, mental capacity, nature of body, physical environment, and
even of sex. The
personality does not re-incarnate; the Individuality at each re-birth
projects a new personality, the qualities and tendencies of which are
drawn from the sum-total of all past lives-not only the last one. All
the past experience is within and behind each personality and can be
reached and realized, yet may remain entirely latent or partially so,
according to a more or less intensive conception of personality as a
thing in itself and of physical existence as the only reality.


Q. If the physical life and experience controls the after-death
states, it would seem as though the higher planes were controlled by
life on the physical plane ?

A. They would be so controlled, if the after-death states could be
called "higher planes", but as the after- death states of Kama-Loka
and Devachan are the effects of the life last lived, and are both
personal in experience, they cannot properly be called higher planes.
Kama-Loka and Devachan represent respectively the "low" and the "high"
subjective states of the life last lived as a person. The higher
planes of being pertain to the triad of Atma-Buddhi-Manas, the real
Individuality, who, as the immortal being, possesses all the knowledge
gained through all past experiences.


Q. In the case of a nation that engages in war, thus encouraging the
lower instincts, would it not draw into incarnation lower egos ?

A. In the case of each ego in a body, the results will depend upon the
motive which actuated him in engaging in war or in any other
direction. A nation is composed of individual units, the nature of the
action in any given case depending upon the ruling motive of the
individual. If the motives of the units engaged in war were for
justice and freedom, regardless of the necessary war-like acts, then
when the objects were obtained and peace resumed, those units would
still be actuated by the same motives and would draw egos of like
nature. The condition of war may equally provide greater opportunities
for self-sacrificing righteous action, and for selfish license and
debasement; which it shall be depends upon the nature and choice of
the unit. A nation has no existence apart from the units which compose
it. A selfish peace will result in greater per versions than any
number of wars waged for righteous purposes; selfishness lies at the
root of all sin, sorrow and suffering.


Q. What difference does it make what kind of a family an ego is drawn
into; it might as well have its experience in one way as well as
another?

A. The question implies a denial of individual karma, and in fact
karma of any sort; it leaves out of consideration the fact of the
needs of the Soul by way of discipline and experience. The entrance
into birth of an ego, together with the conditions connected with that
birth, are pre-determined by the individual merit or demerit of
previous lives. The ego cannot enter birth until such conditions as
meet its needs are present. Law rules in all such matters, or nothing
could be predicted as a resultant of any course of thought and action.


Q. The ego might in some cases have a very long time to wait, might he
not?

A. Time with the ego is not what it is with our limitation of
conceptions; he is self-conscious and active on higher planes, and
"time" as we know it does not affect him as ego; it is only when the
culmination of conditions which he while in the body helped to produce
is consummated, that he is unavoidably drawn back to rebirth. Rebirth
is due to our unremedied defects, not to our virtues.


Q. Is there any place in nature in which there is a ruling law of
Heredity?

A. Heredity prevails on all planes of being; we inherit the resultants
of our activities on all planes. Vie may know our earthly pedigree,
hut who of us has ever traced all the links of heredity, astral,
psychic and spiritual which go to make us what we in reality are? The
Secret Doctrine speaks of three general lines of heredity, the
Spiritual, the Intellectual, and the Physical, and says that these
three are intermixed and interblended at every point.


Q. The trend of the Gita is in the direction of freedom from rebirth.
Is not a righteous and happy existence in a body the chief end of Man?

A. That would imply that the whole trend of evolution was toward a
material existence, whereas all the facts point in the direction that
the Real Man is in essence Spiritual, and has in the immensity of his
past ac cumulated vast stores of knowledge, by means of which He has
contacted and is working with, what is generally called Matter, but
which in reality is the intelligence and embodiment of entities of a
much lower kind. His object is not to seek and make permanent a
perfect physical embodiment for Himself, but by his contact and use of
these lower lives to gradually give them the impulse toward
self-consciousness, which alone can arouse to action the latent
spirituality in all these lower intelligences. The word Spirituality
does not mean a hazy, indefinite condition, as many regard it, but "an
intimate knowledge of the ultimate essence of every thing in Nature."
The Real Man-the Triad of Atma Buddhi-Manas---- therefore descended
into "matter"-to use such a misunderstood term-in order to con tact,
understand it as the embodiment and expression of the innumerable
intelligences of which it is corn posed, and give these lives impulse
and direction towards self-consciousness. That He has failed to carry
out-as 1-Te might have done-tile initial self-sacrificing purpose, is
due to the illusions pertaining to sentient existence, in which He has
become involved by setting up causes which inevitably under karma keep
him fluctuating between Birth, Death, Kama-Loka and Devachan in a
continuing series. The freedom from rebirth of which the Gita speaks,
is obtained by setting up causes born from an understanding of Man's
real nature and mission, and action on the basis of that under
standing while in a body. Once the chain of lower causation is broken
by Him, 1-le is free to choose, and more over has brought into play on
all planes the sum-total of his knowledge. From then on, His field is
the whole of Nature, visible and invisible; He will then live a
conscious existence in Spirit, not in Matter, and can, while occupying
bodies of temporary duration, maintain and use His spiritual
self-consciousness, knowledge and power on that plane of existence,
without detriment or hindrance. Such are the results of "freedom from
re birth"; instead of loss, as so many imagine, it means immeasurable
gain; the goal is worthy of all effort.


Q. How can we in our ignorance make that effort?

A. The Masters of Wisdom have supplied us with the necessary means.
Ignorance is destroyed only by Knowledge. Ignorance is composed of
false conceptions, and actions on the basis of false conceptions can
only lead to more ignorance and its results in sin, sorrow and
suffering. The Theosophical Philosophy, as given by Those who brought
it, must be learned, studied and applied in all our relations with our
fellow- men; this must be done by each of us, no one can do it for us.
This implies that our predilections and prejudices acquired from an
adoption of the ordinary views of life must be given up, and the basis
of thought and action that the Philosophy indicates must take their
place. The Devotional books, such as the Gita and the Voice should be
constantly read and meditated upon, for they tend to arouse spiritual
perceptions. With the means supplied, and an effort to act for and as
the Self of all, channels will be opened up within our selves that
will lead to Inner knowledge. As the Master said, "All Nature is
before you; take what you can."


Q. Then the after-death states would be the building-in of the
experiences gained?

It should be understood that the after-death states of Kama-Loka and
Devachan are wholly personal in their nature. The sloughing off of the
purely terrestrial de sires and passions is Kama-Loka; the
assimilation and enjoyment of all that was best in the life last
lived, is the Devachanic condition. Both states are Subjective, that
is-the being in both states is occupied with his own thoughts, desires
and feelings; is not aware of the presence of other beings, nor in
contact with them. The world he lives in is peopled by his own
creations, which are as real to him as were the physical beings he
moved among during his bodily existence. Having had his varied
experience in the physical world, he leaves the body which served him
as the means of contact with physical beings and lives in the desires,
feelings and thoughts which his contact with the physical plane had
engendered. At death-of which the being is not aware, being still his
conscious thinking self-the thoughts prevailing are those that sprung
from his relations with others in bodies and necessarily relate to his
desires- this is Kama-Loka, the place or state of Desire. As his
purely physical desires are not reinforced or stimulated by contact
with other beings, they gradually die out, and his higher ideals and
attributes remain as the basis for the Devachanic state, a state where
no thought of sin, sorrow, suffering or death can enter, or even that
such things exist. In both states he feels himself to be the same
person, obtains his compensation for the sorrows of life in Devachan
and assimilates in that state the best of his life last lived, adding
the result to his inner egoic nature. Then a new birth based upon the
unexpended causes generated during previous lives.


Q. What is meant by "unexpended causes"?

A. If-as is shown-we have lived many lives and have affected other
incarnated beings in a way that re quires adjustment by us, and the
co-ordination of our lives heretofore has not been such as to bring us
in contact so as to make that adjustment possible, these unexpended
causes will have to be met as effects In some life and either
adjusted, or strengthened as further causes. We may be meeting in this
life the effects of causes set in motion many lives back as well as
those. of a more recent causation. As we think over the contacts with
others in this present life, we will find some that were friendly for
a time, and others that were inimical, but both of which are but
memories now, our
external connections with those persons having ceased. These friends
or enemies of ours are still what we made them, and although the
feelings then engendered have no present means of manifestation,
nevertheless they remain as unexpended causes in our nature, and in
the natures of those friends and enemies, the effects of which will be
experienced when we meet again in this or future lives. The lapse of
time does not change the power or nature of the cause. We should
therefore make friends for the future as Jesus advised in saying,
"Forgive your enemies; do good to them that despite- fully use you and
persecute you".


Q. It would seem then that we are bound by an endless chain of cause
and effect to earth-life?

A. It would be, and is an "endless chain" if we persist in setting
causes in motion that bind us to rebirth; but this we need not do, and
would not, if we knew our real nature. It is to point the way to
freedom from re birth that Theosophy was given to us, to relieve us
from the dire necessity which the operation of the Law of Karma in
ourselves compels us to undergo. The Gita says "Freedom comes from a
renunciation of self-interest in the fruits of our actions". Not that
we should desire to escape, but that we should so think and act as to
bring about the purposes of Soul. This we can do when we know and
realize our real nature and act in accordance with It, for in It lies
the source of all power, and with It the freedom of choice.


Q. Then a Master who occupied a body for the benefit of Humanity would
not pass through the Kama- Lokic and Devachanic states after the death
of the body?

A. No. He would occupy the body without being attached to it. He would
be living a conscious existence in Spirit, while being "in all things
like unto us" as far as appearances go. He would know how to balance
Cause and Effect in all that He did, having no attachment to either
and acting only for the good of all. Operating through a body with
full knowledge, He would have no illusions and therefore no personal
subjective states like Kama-Loka or Devachan, and on leaving the body,
would exist in His own true nature as He had been existing all the
time. As an ancient saying is: "He loves, and He understands", and He
serves Humanity as best He can.


Q. In returning to birth does the Ego have to pass through the same
experiences in Kama-Loka that he passed through after the death of the
body?

A. He does not pass through the same experiences for they were those
of that personal life, and in re birth a new combination of the Ego's
past lives, Consisting of such unexpended causes as the particular
period of re-birth permits, makes up the new personality. The Ego,
however, finds awaiting him those Kamic tendencies which he had not
overcome; at the same time he will be strengthened by his Devachanic
assimilation.


Q. An Ego who had exhausted his Devachanic experiences and required
re-birth but found nothing that suited his requirements would be in a
miserable state would he not?

A. We must remember the nature of the Ego. He is not any of his
personalities; they make up the field of his earthly experiences. When
the best effects of the life last lived are exhausted in Devachan and
the sum of them added to all past experiences of the Ego, be they
great or small, all personal illusions have vanished. He exists as
Ego, and-to use a phrase-reviews the past and sees what must follow
under Karma. Our conceptions of time have no effect upon the Ego;
karmic conditions alone move him; when these are ready he sinks into
re-birth in that race, period and family that will give him the
requisite environment according to his individual karma.


Q. Two lines at the foot of page 73, that the divergences from
physical heredity are vastly greater than the transmitted traits,
would indicate that physical heredity is not a law?

A. Physical heredity is a process by which the Law is fulfilled. There
is necessarily a karmic connection between the ego entering birth and
the parents and family into which he comes. The parents furnish the
embodiment with those tendencies that best meet the in coming ego's
requirements for that life. There are Three lines of evolution, the
Spiritual, the Manasic or Intellectual, and the Physical, and these
three are inter mixed and interblended at every point.


Q. Please explain Spiritual Heredity?

A. According to the Secret Doctrine there are Seven great hierarchies
of spiritual beings; every human being is a descent from one or
another of those Seven great classes of being. This question however
requires special study before any attempt at a comprehensible reply
could be made; the Secret Doctrine will give all the information
available.


Q. The earth is such a small planet in the vast assemblage of planets,
would that not indicate that people incarnated here from other
planets?

A. Not if we understand the workings of Karma. We are connected
spiritually, intellectually, astrally and physically with the beings
which constitute the evolutionary stream of this earth, and can no
more separate ourselves from them than we can separate our physical
heart from our head and exist as physical beings. We are karmically
indebted to all the kingdoms connected with the earth for every
vehicle of consciousness that we possess; our minds also are colored
and limited by the mind of the race to which we belong. The same is
true of the humanities of other planets; they must reap where they
have sown, they cannot reap where they have not sown. As we rise to
Egoic consciousness we will transcend all ideas of particular
localities, and be sensible of varying conditions rather than places
or planets.


Q. Well, after having reached all knowledge there would be no need of
reincarnating ?

A. Perhaps not in this race; perhaps not on this earth again; but
all-knowledge is useless unless it is used; all-knowledge implies the
knowledge gained by all beings, it does not contain that which has not
been gained. Progress is continuous in possibility and in an infinite
universe there is no stopping-place; to cease to progress is to
stagnate. The ancient saying is that we can always approach the light,
but we can never touch the flame, for that flame is our Self-the Self
of All.


Q. Can one tell whether a soul is progressing by any one incarnation?

A. One can realize for himself his own ignorance and quickly or slowly
gain real knowledge. He may realize what past lives must have been
from the nature and strength of the difficulties he encounters in the
struggle. It is enough if he sees the real goal and ever struggles
towards it, and it will be well for him if he thinks not at all of his
own progress but of what he can do to help others progress. "To live
to benefit mankind is the first step."


Q. In the chapter it says that people are incarnated together who have
been together in other incarnations. Would that necessarily be
continuous?

A. We must remember that what we call "people" are Souls that we have
met in bodies before, and in bodies have karmically connected
ourselves with them for good or for evil. The bodily connection is
brought about by the mutual karmic connection and from wise or foolish
choice. The continuity of such relations depends upon our desires, but
we cannot control the de sires of those who do not want what we do. As
long as we hold to "likes and dislikes" as our basis, we will meet
with those who occasioned them, while the latter in their turn may
have changed from "like" to "dislike" or the reverse. We can "come out
from among them" by not permitting our likes or dislikes to govern us.
while being friendly and helpful to all. "The wise man seeks that
which is homogeneous with his own nature."


Q. Since we are in our present form as Humanity for eighteen million
years, it would seem that if there were no wars there would be no room
for all of us?

A. Let us take another view of the question: if the earth has lasted
for eighteen millions of years and there is no record of its being
overcrowded at any time, why should we fear any such condition? It has
been stated that while the number of reincarnating egos connected with
the earth is very great, the number is limited in fact, there having
been no increase of egos since the middle point of the seven rounds.
Further, as those egos had no small part in the formation of the
earth, there can be no doubt that it will accommodate in their proper
periods all egos connected with it. The Law of Compensation or Karma
adjusts all things to the need of the beings in manifestation. And
while we are considering the question do let us not forget that our
earth is in reality composed of six degrees of sub stance besides that
which we perceive through our physical senses-the lowest of all.


Q. It is said that by living according to the dictates of the Soul,
the brain may be made porous. Can that be explained?

A. It has been often stated that the body and brain are formed from
the food, the brain being more plastic than any other organ of the
body. Naturally the characteristics of our brain will be in accordance
with our modes of thought and feeling. If our ways of thinking are
purely personal, selfish and physical, the brain will only respond to
such impressions; but by thinking on high ideals and acting in
accordance with them the brain will gradually become impressionable by
them. When the Change has been brought about. the brain will record
all that goes on during sleep of the body, and we will be in touch
with all our past existences and our whole inner nature. The "high
ideals" spoken of are not the so-called high ideals of mankind which
are based upon physical existence, but those which the Secret Doctrine
shows to be concerned with the real Spiritual nature, its laws, and
the real meaning of Evolution on all planes.


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[ extracts from ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS AQUARIAN THEOSOPHIST AN OCEAN OF
THEOSOPHY CLASS

by R. Crosbie

DTB