Theos-Talk Archives (March 2003 Message tt00058)

Hi, "I am immortal" is a thought. To THINK this breaks material down in such a way that one cannot fully BE, as this kind of thinking creates a reference point or remainder which is always in relationship to the psychological complex of ones ordinary reactive self (personality) which has been formed and conditioned by life or nature. In my opinion this kind of talk is a form of ignorance and no person of real understanding would talk in this way, except if it were time -appropriate in relationship to the realization of a specific aim and in this served a function, but maybe I am wrong. I will be going into this in great detail, little by little in the weeks to come and examining this idea again and again until those who have an openness and a genuine curiosity can begin to understand. If you disagree with me, feel free to start a dialogue as long as you use your own words, speak from your own understanding and experience and keep it simple. In this way we can all learn together. Bring to your friends to this list now so they can participate. You will not need to be a so called theosophist to understand this discussion though it will surely be of very great value to anyone who is a theosophist.

This is just a preliminary message.When a person say "We are immortal" and tells this again and again to other people, this needs to serve a FUNCTION of some kind or it is utterly meaningless and pouring from the empty into the void. We do not want to do this as we will lose our grip or the underlying sense of "I am" which can serve as a pure vibrational foundation for a kind of active making or creative activity which is CONSCIOUS. If I cannot explain the function of this concept of being "immortal" yet continue to cling to it, than it must serve a function that supports something in my psychological self (personality) that I am unable to let go of.

Of course if there is no psychological self but only pure essence and an alive (liberated from conditioning) intelligence which deliberately controls the external manifestations of the personality (rather than their being mechanically activated by aimless and fragmented reactions to variously triggered portions of a psychological complex), then there is no "me" to die, but only a body, so in this sense, there is a connection to something eternal, but nothing psychological to be connected to it, so it is an oxymoron to speak of being "immortal," as there would be nothing to relate to it. This is very important to understand and we can go into it in detail.

But re. literal "immortality," one must look at the human body in relationship to the SUN of this solar system and understand that everything that we know as human is in relationship to this sun. It may be possible to claim our true birthright for AS LONG AS THIS SOLAR SYSTEM EXISTS, but even this would be very unlikely, as we have mother NATURE to contend with on this matter, and she has other plans for us. What is CONSCIOUS AIM and how can this figure into the formation of the material of an I that is more permanent? If I already AM, than what I do will create order out of chaos, but if this is NOT the case, if there are only different I's triggered as reactions along with flickers of self consciousness, than something needs to record this. Without this recording process I will never know myself but will continue to live in illusion and fantasy (no matter how noble my feelings seem to me) and encourage others to do the same. Everything starts at the beginning of a pure" I am." If I want to base my further activities on something that is not fragmented by external circumstances into mechanical thoughts, feelings and patterns of activity, a lengthy and impartial self study is required, whether I like it or not. It is a fact of being. Without making this kind of study, there can be no real being, which is always in present time with no remainder, but there will only be mechanical reactive processes and a fantasy, no matter how pleasurable, until my own wolf which I have ignored comes back to devour me in the form of an external war or whatever, because I did not know how to keep opposing forces contained within myself in such a way that something could be elevated, thereby saving the sheep. Sincerely, Wry


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