Theos-Talk Archives (December 2002 Message tt00592)

Dec. 18 2002

Dear Friends:


Patanjali's YOGA SUTRAS is one of my favourite books to study.

Have you figured out how he distinguishes between the HIGHER and the
Lower MIND ? It is one of the most difficult things, as the duality
of MANAS is implied, recognized and then we are shown how to make use
of the situation.

As I see it, that is important and hinges on the REINCARNATION of the
HIGHER MIND
( EGO ) -- of course Higher MANAS is always indissolubly linked with
ATMA and BUDDHI. The "3 IN ONE" are the Reincarnating Entity -- the
real "WE."

Have you seen Judge's rendition of the book ?

I think it is available trough http://www.blavatsky.net


I have not read Taimni's rendition yet.


I always ask, when considering such writings and teachings:

1.	WHO ACTS?

2.	WHY IS THERE AN ACTION TO BE DONE ? ( Cause )

3.	WHAT IN NATURE DEMANDS AN ENTITY TO ACT ?

4.	WHAT ARE THE ALTERNATIVES TO CHOOSE FROM ?

5.	WHAT ARE THE TOOLS AND METHODS TO BE USED ?

6.	HOW DO WE ASSURE OURSELVES OF IMPERSONALITY AND OF UNIVERSALITY?
HOW ARE WE TO MAKE SURE THAT AN ACTION IS ESSENTIAL ?

7.	WHAT LAWS OF NATURE ARE INVOLVED ?

8.	IF THERE IS AVIDYA (ignorance) WHY AND HOW DID THAT HAPPEN ?

9.	IF CORRECT ACTION IS TO BE DONE WHO WILL BENEFIT ?

10.	How would "ANATMAN" be defined? If ATMA is ALL-PERVASIVE and
ETERNAL, then ANATMA is only a hypothetical concept and requires very
close examination and definition.

One might take the idea that duality lies in the concept of
ATMA-BUDDHI -- Buddhi being the primordial pure spiritual SUBSTANCE
that serves as a temporary and deliberate reflector of ATMA. In other
words ATMA focused in a very minute particle of refined SUBSTANCE (
Suddha-Sattva ? ). This process occurs in "manifestation cycles"
( Manvantara. When Pralaya comes the whole is resolved back into the
ONE the ALL. And yet the skandhas remain as points of memory, and
demand under Karma a chance to revive and continue their individual
pilgrimages. Theosophy speaks of the Monads in evolution consisting
of the joint triune INDIVIDUALITY consisting of ATMA-BUDDHI- MANAS.
But some would debate this.

And so on -- many questions to be asked and answered so that there may
be a clarity the position of the actor, the thinker, and the selector
(or 'actor.')

Best wishes

Dallas

=======================



-----Original Message-----
From: samblo
Sent:	Wednesday, December 18, 2002 1:38 PM
To:	To:
Subject:	Re: to Dallas - Anatman

Dallas and All,

Thanks so much for your most stimulating propositions and listed
questions.

These are the very fruitful inquiries for all of us. I just happened
to
have been reading "The Yoga Sutra of Patanjali" as published by Quest
Books and
Authored by I. K. Taimni when you posted this and was on the very
topic you
inquire after.

Beginning on page 127 the exposition on "Avidya" and by what process
it brought into manifestation and consequence thereof tied to the
contrast between "Asmi" (I AM) and "Asmti" (I Am that) in original
production of State of Avidya (Ignorance).

Particularly helpful is Taimni's explanation of the 5 "Kles'as" [Love
of life, cleaving to existence] having "Avidya" as Root.


>From an Adwaita, Shaivites make a correlation to the 5 Acts of Shiva'

1.	PROJECTION (The so-called Mayavic reality).

2. MAINTENANCE (The perpetuation of the Mayavic reality).

3. VEILING (The State of no longer having direct conscious
communion with Unity
of Transcendental Being-ness, (yet still having conscious remembrance
though corporeal or subtle state).

4. WITHDRAWAL (The State wherein one in repealed of even the memory
of
Original Pure Being and Self-Nature)

5. GRACE (The Return to the State of Union or Native Original
BE-NESS).

Reference: THE SIVA' SUTRA -- The Yoga of Supreme Identity:
Author: Jaideva Singh


An interesting view - Adam in the state of Numbers 1 and 2 (above) was
yet in Union and therefore "walked and talked with God" but in the
descent into the
Mayavic Reality both He and Eve under went the detailed process
explained in Patanjali
by Taimni and the benchmarks are "the 5 Acts of Siva" .... The
"Descent" characterizes
that Being through Intention, and Will "adopts a point of being" that
then acts as proxy of it's activity.

Here is a very nice work if one can find a copy that I suggest
contains elaboration's
correlate to the recent threads on "Maya", Sakti", Karma, etc.

"SAKTI CULT OF ANCIENT INDIA" Author: Dr. Pushipendra Kumar M.A.
Ph.D., F.R.A.S (London) Bhartiya Publishing House-- Varanasa , 1974

This work indulges in an astute survey from earliest Bharat pre-Vedic.
Vedic. Puranic, and later developed doctrine contained in the many
differentiation's from the Seed (Bhijna .)