Theos-Talk Archives (October 2002 Message tt00017)

OCT 3 2002

Der Friends:

Re: Time and the Mind -- Creativity and Art

Taken in the scope of eternal duration any measure we might
make of time is a definition which we can understand, and if
made part of this incarnations education we assume others
have adopted the same dimensions.

Actually it is a part of the materialization of this age and
range of perceptions. It is therefore related to fixing
either memory (history) or anticipation (planning for a
concrete aspect of the future).

As to fantasy and daydreams, they indicate that we are
conscious on other planes of perception than the merely
objective: "that which is in front of us." It is one of
the proofs that the human MIND and human THOUGHT are not
mere figments of brain activity, motivated by chaotic
desires.

Another is the operation of the WILL. We desire and then
employ WILL to achieve projections. This does not tell us
what WILL is, only that it is a creative and a formative
force which we have. So we use it without thinking of how
or why we do so.

One of its functions is to imprint IDEAS on our memory
tablets, and, it can be employed to achieve results either
in thought or in actions, and therefore it is a link or a
translator of the thought process.

First as considering many ideas and their possible results.

Second of selecting that which seems best suited to our
desire.

Thirdly, it provides us with the necessary assembly of tools
and materials, and especially of the creative tools so our
IDEA can be translated into the material.

There we may see looking about us at our present world and
civilization, that it has gradually been concretized, and
while many disparate results may be seen in technology, art,
economics, protection of the environment, investigation of
the past and current religions and philosophies, etc..., we
may see these as individual works of art, music, poetry, a
scientific report, the ruling of a nation, etc... the
building of a dam or a roadway.

Our whole civilization is seen to be the emergence of the
force of general creativity along certain broad lines. If
we are able to accurately review the past, we will see that
the word of Plato (for instance) held a different set of
customary values to be important as compared to ours.

The imprinting force (will) determines the length of a handy
memory -- easily reanimated. Others fade as time and disuse
allows the to fade into a general background, sometimes
difficult to reanimate.

The teachings of Krishnamurthi are of great assistance if we
realize how absolutely honest he was.

He is an outstanding example of one who practiced this
important and pivotal virtue. But if you read them
carefully you will find that he was apparently not trained
or taught in H P B's kind of Theosophical lore and
information. Perhaps this is why he left the THEOSOPHICAL
SOCIETY as it was no longer studying or practicing
theosophy.

Best wishes,

Dallas

==============================

-----Original Message-----
From: Larry F Kolts [mailto:llkingston2@juno.com]
Sent: Wednesday, October 02, 2002 6:20 PM
To: study@blavatsky.net
Subject: Where are they now? Time will tell -- or not?

I've been thinking a lot about this today.

How does this relate to one of the major themes of
Krishnamurti such as
his dialogues with David Bohm in THE ENDING OF TIME. He and
others such
as Scott Morrision and Eduard Tolle devote much effort into
speaking of
how we can live only in the present without the bagage of
the past or the
stressful anxieties of the future.

It would seem to me Christina, that when we daydream while
driving for
instance, we are usually engaged in some fantasy that has
nothing to do
with the "now." If a deer were to jump in front of the car
as they often
do in these parts, we would instantly be very much in the
"now."

So while your example is good to show how we do lose track
of time, or
how relative time can be, it doesn't address living in the
present
moment. Does anyone see any real value in these teaching of
K and the
others on time?

As Peter wrote, interesting how this discussion has
progressed.

Larry

On Tue, 1 Oct 2002 20:34:24 -0700 "christina"
<christina@md.prestige.net>
writes:

> Time is turning the subjective into the objective, isn't
it?
>
> I think on some level we get a sense of what an illusion
time is: on
> occasion we are given a reminder -- when the alarm clock
beeps in
> the morning and just a moment ago you were just settling
under cover to
> get a good night's sleep; or when you drive home from work
leaving the
> parking lot, and then, after going over all sorts of
things in thought,
> all of a sudden you are turning into your driveway 15
miles later.
> Don't recall the passage of time -- it seems that it was
only a moment ago
> you were at work. Your mind transcends time in these
examples, i think.
> Evidence of seperation of mind and body is the fact that
your
> brain's 'rote memory autopilot' seperately controlled you,
which in turn
> controlled your vehicle, which got you where you needed to
get, and
> at the same time your mind was not on the road, but busy
contemplating
> other things. I don't mean full fledged day dreaming--just
everyday
> preoccupation.
>
> Is this a good example?