Theos-Talk Archives (March 2002 Message tt00520)

Along with this , can we say whether or not science has figured out "the 
mathematics
of the sacrifice of the molecule", or whether or not such a mode exists, or 
has a right to exist in the scientific world? Like ethics , sacrifice 
will be said to be non-quantifiable but nonetheless that does not rule out 
its existence as stated by any or all the great Masters past, present,future. 
The Masters of Wisdom seem to have figured out this math and have tried to 
communicate it to us.
5555555555555555555555555
Subj: RE: Theos-World a thought...
Date: 3/29/02 3:34:32 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: dalval14@earthlink.net
Reply-to: <A HREF="mailto:theos-talk@yahoogroups.com";>
theos-talk@yahoogroups.com</A>
To: study@blavatsky.net (AA-B-Study)

Friday, March 29, 2002

Dear Friends:

Re: Recycling? Proofs ?

Let us say that any consideration that leads to understanding and
determination will inevitably:

1. Teach us to think impartially and weigh all information with
the touchstone of universality.

2. Teach us how to identify personal opinions and prejudice.

3. Teach how to follow a trend of observed data to the exclusion
of all modifying factors.

4. Teach us how and why such "modifying factors" are found
introduced in most conclusions.

5. Teach us how to become impersonal and universal as observers.

6. Teach us how the accurate observation of events is to be
achieved.

7. Teach us how to investigate reports and conclusions made,
regardless of time, by those who have preceded us in such
research and left as evidence their conclusions. (Be they the
"Ancients" or moderns. Modernity alone. is no guarantee of
accuracy or of freedom from prejudice.)

8. Give us some basis from which to determine if those
conclusions of the past, and work done and reported by others
have merit, and if so how much.

9. Show us where we can make contributions to further the advance
of a search for actuality, for truth for the operation of Laws.

10. Show us that Nature alone provides for all of us, regardless
of our variations, a habitat that is cooperative, supportive,
and, provides innumerable opportunities for individual research
and advance.

Let us start:

Recycling of the Atoms:

Science teaches the immutability and indestructible nature of the
ATOM. The atom is not entirely definable by science except as a
moving living and actual FORCE with which are associates a host
of minor constituents and components each interacting with the
rest to construct that Power which seems to have in our
perception an existence. Actually it is only the "molecule" that
our instrumentation is able to notice and record as a "presence."
If we probe below the molecular level, we seem to pass into a
realm of force and forces -- we secure indications of the forces
which represent what is called an "atom." The "atom" is actually
non-physical. it is the first step into the ASTRAL PLANE we can
just barely touch.

Theosophy offers us the concept of the IMMORTAL DIVINE MONADS
that fill all space, and are intimate to our physical,
infra-physical and meta-physical natures. These concretize and
become the atoms, molecules, cells with which our Science is
increasingly familiar.

That the forces involved at this minute stage are enormously
powerful is witnessed by the enormous size of the apparatus
(cyclotrons, bevatrons, plasma generators, etc...) we have to
devise to separate and an analyse them as they are temporarily
altered or "destroyed." Our Science does not create, but in its
work of analysis, it destroys -- so as to take note of the
residues of such a process. Those are the ever finer forces
identified as sub-atomic. Some of these, it is speculated by
Science, are among the primary products of the re-manifestation
of the physical universe out of the astral one. To this even it
is also speculated belong certain electro-magnetic vibrations
that continue till this moment and seem to be endless and
deathless.

Atoms, we are told by Science, are constantly recycled from
molecule to molecule -- and under such laws as NATURE in her
universal urge to grow and improve provides. This recycling
process is deemed to express the law of conformity, of continuity
and of invariableness. The atom lives and moves eternally. It
is speculated, for instance, that if a condition of ABSOLUTE ZERO
can be reached then the atomic movement ceases. But this remains
to be proved as physical apparatus can never achieve that
ultimate state.

Recycling of the immortal Spirit-Soul:

This is of course a Theosophical doctrine. It states briefly that
every such Unit has to pass consciously through all aspects of
material existence, so that it may emerge under its own volition
and self-will and become self-consciously Universal in its
capacities.

The view that Theosophy advances concerning the production and
existence of the Kosmos, starts with the SPIRITUAL DIVINE SOURCE
of LIFE, [ without limiting this, it is compared with a universal
basis for everything, an eternal background, whether in or out of
"manifestation," and speaks of ITS "descent into matter."

There. after many aeons, IT emerges, having passed through all
experiences (by re-embodiment and reincarnation) on all the
planes of experience and sensation. This process enables it to
store in its personal and individual memory the experiences it
has undergone and from which it has emerged as a n independent
and free-willed MIND.

It is held that our present humanity, as a whole, has passed
through half of this process (the descent of Spirit into matter),
and is now beginning to work out the problems associated with an
immortal Mind, sheathed in its physical and astral bodies and
further enveloped by desires and passions that are purely selfish
in nature and which tend to isolate it into a condition of merely
selfish considerations. The panorama opened before us all is the
fact that experience -- mentally, we can perceive these factors
as separate limitations, each with its own rules and life, and
the whole making up the complexity of our natures.

What does this really mean?

It means that the immortal and divine Real Man, innate to each of
us, is opening up intellectually to the potentials that an
Immortal faces: A comprehension of its environment and of the
karmic limitations that choice it made earlier are now imposing
on it. It sees the field of its action and also its limitations.
it perceives opening before it unlimited opportunities. it also
perceived the limitations of individual duty and
responsibility --- since it cannot escape the company of others
like itself -- immortal Pilgrims -- all pursuing a similar
conjoined and interactive program.

The great internal conflict on the emotional and moral plane of
sensitivity is that which faces the immortal CONSCIOUSNESS, (in
each of us), now made aware of others to which it owes the duty
of brotherhood.

Another area of "proof" in matters relating to human
consciousness and experience are the mass of NDE ( Near Death
Experiences) and the many children, who at an early age speak of
a "past life," or "learning and knowing different languages.
University studies of these have been proceeding for the past 80
to 100 years. Additionally there is the question of
individualism of capacity in the power of intellectual thought,
empathy, psychic perceptions (a very wide range), and these show
themselves at various ages in life, but are most striking in the
cases of young children.

Let us return to those aspects of observations where Science
overwhelming demonstrates the existence and operation of LAW.
Those are facts and developments that provide us to day with our
"civilization" and all its many mechanical and instrumental
wonders -- which have so extended our powers to perceive the
reign of VIBRATIONS in all aspects of sense perception.

One outstanding factor is that it takes in every case a HUMAN
MIND to notice, observe, record and evaluate ensuing data, and
then, from that to frame, in statistics and probability, a
statement of LAW as regards certain repeatable experiments and
methods. Repetition demonstrates the existence of some kind of
LAW -- of a natural avenue of work, already innate and existing
in Nature, and relative to the engagement of the activities that
are being controlled and the results witnessed.

Science studies those laws in operation in every department of
Nature for the past 2 or 300 tears. I believe it is safe to say
that NATURE has everything well arranged and that we are catching
up on a more intimate knowledge of her rules, laws and programs.
Our investigations confirm over a wide time and space area that a
sameness ( meme ) and a repetitiousness pervades her fields.

It is agreed in the Sciences that when an event can be repeated
with fair and demonstrable accuracy over a long time, and in all
places, the evidence of a LAW is plain. Those laws are not
"created" by science. But the terminology that Science uses is
employed to define such laws they detect to be experimentally
present in NATURE. There is no outcry about observations and
their recording, when those are honest, true and sincere.

Problems arise when, because of prejudice or other
considerations, men and women who are scientists, allow their
records to be altered, suppressed or otherwise concealed as to
their accuracy, because of such prejudices -- which may arise
from religion or "peer-pressure" -- and this peer-pressure
generally arises from those who are constituted the examiners who
duty it is to pass on the knowledge, honesty and accuracy of such
candidates for graduation as they might have the duty to review.

The result are framed in teaching areas concerning mathematics,
physics, chemistry, biology, engineering, medicine, astronomy,
geology, metallurgy, chemical engineering, electronics, magnetism
and electricity in application, etc...and, the only uncertainties
we are faced with on which speculation and doubt are rampant is :
politics, social studies, morals, ethics, and the general emotion
and mental interaction of every one who can be identified as a
responsible mind-beings.

Why should the social and the psychological sciences present such
a confused area?

A study of the Theosophical doctrines concerning the nature of
the human being and his capacities and configuration will answer
that.

Our Science is either unable or unwilling to define the areas of
human sensitivity and behavior that provide us with a base for
understanding who and what the ESSENTIAL "WE" -- the
INTELLIGENCE, and the CONSCIOUSNESS that we use, and ARE.

It is also unwilling to use, or even investigate, the information
that has been provided by the Ancients in this regard. It seeks
for a material basis for intelligence and perceives as a final
resort nerve and "brain activity." It cannot yet identify the
CAUSES for brain activity, but notes the electrical and magnetic
flow that always accompanies sensation in its perceptive or
generative aspects.

Such being the case, the Theosophical concept of SPIRITUAL and
SOUL IMMORTALITY is scoffed at, for the reason that the SPIRIT
and the SOUL are not analyzable in terms of the instrumentation
they have devised, and which is limited by physical action. They
do not realize, for instance, that the human being (taken as a
whole, with all its variations) is itself, the living actual
evidence for these "principles." Also, they cannot yet well
distinguish between:

1. THOUGHTS and the MIND that generates them, and

2. the EMOTIONS and the desires, passions vices and virtues,
selfishness and short-sighted objectives that the "personal"
being makes plain to any one who observes their presence and
action.

In our consideration of the range of evidence and proof that we
can find in nature we may say with justice, that observation
demonstrates uniformly, that Nature does not cheat, nor does it
"play favorites." That in itself offers us a comfort in regard
to the propositions that Theosophy draws our attention to.

Some feel and say that Theosophy is religious. We might say the
same concerning Science. But if we limit ourselves
non-speculatively to observation we will secure evidence that
need not be vitiated by prejudice or the preconceptions of either
theological dogmas or scientific claims to veracity in
speculative older theories about creation and development.

We can further observe :

There are "natural" variants and differences of "mix" in
everyone's innate character, capacity, sensitivity to feelings
and thoughts, and talents -- no one is an exact replica of any
one else, although the basic categories that can be observed are
common.

Best wishes,

Dallas


===========================
-----Original Message-----
From: Nisk
Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:27 AM
To:
Subject: A World -- and a thought...

Is there any proof of recycling?