Theos-Talk Archives (March 2001 Message tt00099)

Thursday, March 15, 2001


Dear Mauri:

Your inquiry about "Nirvana" prompts me to ask some questions as
a preliminary:

If we had here and now with all our limitations, the power to see
and know EVERYTHING, what would we do with it?

If we are as Theosophy says, SPIRITUAL BEINGS in our innermost
essence, then, why so we not behave as spiritual beings would?

If we can put honest and sincere answers to these 2 questions
together we might solve the riddle of our present limitations as
well as our potentials -- if we WILL to access and manifest them.


I often wonder why we are so limited. Why do we need to close
out our potentials? Who would choose a prolonged life of
"pleasure, joy and bliss" and leave all his fellows to wallow in
their delusions and suffering?

Why would we choose isolation or ignorance in preference to
living with others, and,

2. Why do we not choose to learn all we can ?

3. What then, is the quality of our DESIRE nature? Can we
isolate it for study? What or who in us is able to do that?
Finally can "desire" be ever satiated?


Dallas

=======================

-----Original Message-----
From: Mauri Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2001 5:30 PM

Subject: [bn-sd] RE: matter is eternal and FORMS DEVELOP from
CHAOTIC SUBSTANCE under guidance and LAW.

RE:
Tue, 13 Mar 2001 17:31:49 -0800

dalval14@earthlink.net

wrote partly:

Mr. Judge wrote a passage on this in the
EPITOME OF THEOSOPHY, p. 28. And, in one of
the FORUM Answers he says: "...if the Adept
voluntarily takes the delights, pleasures and powers
referred to, he is compelled after millions of years
of enjoyment, to re-enter objective nature at the
elemental stage...The whole matter is a reference
to a very obscure doctrine, but little known..." [
Judge, Forum Answers, p. 120 -- ULT ]

==========cut

I'm wondering if (in other words?) Nature is, in
effect, saying: (some?) Nirvanic attainments are
really forms of temporary/incomplete Universal
Relevance (in Higher Karmic terms?) that will, in
turn, (because of their partial nature/relevance,
from some Larger or "Higher" Universal
perspective?) result (as per Higher Karma?) in
some Universal Need for addressing/experiencing
more Universal Relevance, ultimately resulting in
appropriately modified Nirvanic attainments, and
so on?

If so, that termporary Nirvana seems, really,
regardles of its "long term" duration, a kind of
illusory fools paradise, as compared to a Higher
Universal perspective? And one might wonder if
all Nirvanic states, no matter how advanced or
prolonged, are really, in the end, temporary and
even somehow foolish, COMPARATIVELY
speaking (from a Higher Universal perspective),
although, if the comparitive aspect is not
recognised well enough (?) during the Nirvanic
period, the Nirvanee might consider themself . . .
not so foolish, at all. It seems all a matter of
perspective and comparison, not that I'm
suggesting that there's anything particularly wrong
or particularly irrelevant, necessarily, in such
Nirvanic attainments, and I certainly don't know.
I'm just wondering about the possibilities.

Since I have no conscious memory of any
Nirvanically-comparable environment (IF
Devachan can be called that by any stretch of the
imagination?), I can only speculate about the
impact of its reality on my "conscious" decision
making. But of course I speculate without the
benefit of Knowing more about what my
"consciousness" is, in the first place (comparatively
speaking?).

Thinking of the above speculation in ways that
might apply (on a somewhat-comparitive, if
far-removed, level?) to a more every-day sort of
meaning, one might (?) be inclined to consider the
possibilities in a somewhat more-familiar
"every-day" kind of scenario in which one has to
decide between short term gain or long term gain
and all the attendant ramifications and possibilities
and values.

Mauri

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