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RE: [bn-sd] re: Fundamental Propositions WHO ARE "WE?"

Jan 12, 2001 05:32 PM
by dalval14

Friday, January 12, 2001

Re:	What is the "WE" in us ?

Dear Jerome, Mauri:

In thinking this matter of who or what is the "WE" which is
thinking, speaking, hearing, and doing here and now in this
incarnation and in this physical environment, could we not say
that :

1.	the "Lower Manas" (or KAMA-MANAS) has in itself a duality,

2.	one aspect of it tries to emulate and join itself permanently
with the MONADIC aspect of Mind, the BUDDHI-MANAS (or the
Wise-Mind as a portion of the UNIVERSAL MIND - MAHAT) .

3.	The other aspect of the embodied mind (Kama-Manas) becomes the
slave of the Kamic (passions and desires and yearnings and needs)
or the DESIRE Nature (or "Principle").

If my thinking is right, then it is the Lower Manas which
exercises its right to choose the "Path" that it will follow
see VOICE OF THE SILENCE, 2nd. Fragment, THE TWO PATHS as an
example). We have, hence, the doctrinal Paths of the: "Heart,"
and, of the "Head." The "Path of the Heart" is the permanent and
ever-lasting. The "Path of the Head (or Eye)" is the transitory
and the perishable.

On one hand, the "Personal "I" voluntarily chooses the discipline
of the spiritual "I," or, the link between the IMMORTAL SELF
(focused through Buddhi-Manas), and the highest aspect of
Kama-Manas {or that in us which seeks to impersonalise and purify
itself so as to perceive (and anticipate) the way to SPIRITUAL
action and living, in this, our present "matter," with the help
of the INNER INITIATOR (or ATMA-BUDDHI) }. To make it simple:
the highest and purest aspect of Kama-Manas in us decides to
become ONE WITH its "Father Sun" -- the BUDDHI-MANAS.

On the other hand, we have the "Head Path" of limited success in
any one life, whereby we make as much as possible of our
environment subject to our desire and will. This may be for the
general good of ourselves and others or it may end in their
becoming our victims. In any case it involves extreme struggle.
Perhaps the MAHABHARATA epic of India illustrates this well:

I hope this makes sense.

This could lead us to inquire into the nature of the IMMORTAL
being we are said to be at our core -- the MONAD, the real "WE".
1.	The imperishable Monad is ATMA-BUDDHI (represented by
KRISHNA - the "teacher") -- or rather the 'ray" from IT that is
shed on the finest matter that our present evolutionary condition
as a "personality" in this stage makes possible. This might be
said to be the "permanent astral" -- referred to in the article

Most closely affected is the Kamic nature -- hence the resistance
and struggle for supremacy in choice-making between old habits
implanted in earlier incarnations in our "form" (the "Lower
Quarternary), and selfishness; AND, the spiritual and impersonal
condition of an active self-choosing entity that aspires to
"perfection," and knows, and selects its living UNDER KARMA.

The effort to impersonalize KAMA and KAMA-MANAS is the whole
symbolic area of the Mahabharata war in the "Bhagavad Gita," and
the "battle-field" of Kurukshetra -- where Kama (in the nature of
the Kurus: Duryodhana (Evil-desire) and Dhritarashtra (the
physical body) reign). Arjuna, Krishna's pupil exemplifies one
who is struggling to understand the laws of Nature, apply them in
his life and choices, and successfully win his way through
battles with his "lower nature (Kama)" so as to make it pure,
divine and spiritual and merge into the spiritual condition that
Krishna had already attained and was attempting to explain so as
to share its universal power and boundless all-seeing vision (the
"divine Eye") with him.

When the physical base of existence on our plane is destroyed,
the spiritual essence of each person is later, in the
MAHABHARATA, found by Yudhisthira, the last of the Pandava
brother kings, to be in Swarga (Kama-Loka and Devachan) in one or
another after-death intermediate condition, between the life just
over, and the future incarnation. Each one has his own
"life-path" to choose and follow.

While the imagery conveyed by the epic is subject to various
interpretations, the main objective seems to be to establish a
concept of spiritual continuation and of immortality; of
bettering at each life-stage one's spiritual nature, and
imprinting this improvement in the mortal, transitory and
physical bodies (skandhas) drawn to the reincarnating "WE" by our
own KARMA and that of the World around us. Our real body is the
electro-magnetic "astral" body, so the reform is first to be seen
there, as our practice of the virtues leads to its permanency.

So, to me it is the highest aspect of the Kama-Manas that we are
working on, so as to make the consciousness that of an immortal
Monad, endowed with self-consciousness, and fully aware of the
UNIVERSAL laws of our Universe, World and individual Karma -- so
as it may consciously harmonize with all other MONADS in our
environment. Our present "locations" in this incarnation appears
to be an important fact, from which we can start this process of

Do let me know how you react to this, please.



-----Original Message-----
From: Jerome Wheeler []
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2001 7:23 AM
Subject: [bn-sd] re: Fundamental Propositions

jerome comments on this part of Mauri's contribution:
"Mauri" <> writes:
> Would anyone care to comment on what is meant, in
> the text following this quote below, by references to the
"sixth" and "seventh" "interrogative words"?
> =============
"The interrelation between man and the universe, the microcosm
and the
macrocosm, is a mystery so
profound that we have not a sixth appropriate interrogative word
even to
formulate a direct question. Further, the mystery within and
behind the
Causal Interrogation, Why,
> is also so profound that we have not got a seventh
> word to deliberately enquire about it."
> =================================

Mauri, in my opinion the author is being a little bit "precious"!
"writer" is probably alluding to the teaching which asserts that
we are
currently in the Fifth Sub Race of the Fifth Root Race in the
ROUND. True, we probably began the sixth family race of the
Fifth Sub
Race of the Fifth Root race in 1875!! --- BUT THERE I GO! THAT
SOUNDS PRECIOUS TOO!!! When these incredible complex doctrines
are put
into language, they almost immediately become LINEAR. The only
book or
articles I know of that avoid the "linear" trap are those of HPB.
Judge was a voluntary victim to our cecity and therefore served
as an
"antaskarana" between us and HPB.

So, given the above, let's say that of our seven principles we
only four under enough control that we can incarnate in them.
The other
three more or less overshadow us and---according to whether we
aspire or
otherwise---become a more and more vital factor in our life, or
in the
other case become, for practically purposes, non-existent.

Now, the obvious question I find rising in my mind about what I
have just
said is: "Jerome, who is the "We" you are talking about???"
have a nice day


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