Theos-Talk Archives (December 2000 Message tt00004)

Dec 4th., 2000

Dallas offers:

This is most stimulating. Some older and perhaps fresh ideas
emerge in my mind:


As I see it, and in reading the SD, I seem to find:

NOUGHT or ZERO = 0 = A Symbol for "non-manifestation"
ONE = 1 = A Symbol for Universal manifestation
TWO = 2 = DUALITY = a PAIR of OPPOSITES
THREE = 3 = BALANCE = EQUIPOISE
FOUR = 4 = PHYSICAL STABILITY
TEN = 10 = PHYSICAL/SPIRITUAL COMPLETENESS (?)

==========

NOUGHT -- ZERO = 0

In numbers it is the ever-indefinable NOUGHT or ZERO -- from
which any differentiation serves to act as the CAUSE of DUALITY,
and then: MULTIPLICITY -- which ancient symbology bases on
THREE - Three - four. [ The "ALL" or "WHOLE" in MANIFESTATION
totaling a 10 ( TEN or the "perfect" number in manifestation.
4 = material; 3 = spiritual; THREE indicating the Supernal and
IMMUTABLE SPIRITUAL] [ But where and what is the CAUSE, or the
FIRST CAUSE, or the CAUSELESS CAUSE ? ]


ZERO to TEN 0 TO 10

Between the NOUGHT (ZERO) and the TEN (in manifestation) is a
plane (perhaps a 'sphere' -- the true "Pass Not" -- a laya
(layam) 'center' (or plane) which the finite cannot bridge except
in abstract thought.


DOES THE MIND DEPEND ON ENERGY or on MATTER ?

For the "finite Mind" to make that bridge (as we all do from our
stand in the limits of the present period of 'manifestation') in
a conceptual way ( What if ? ), there logically has to be an
immutable connection with the ABSOLUTE ALL -- the UNMANIFESTED.
(Since EVERYTHING, whether in or out of manifestation IS, this
"connection" persists and is indestructible. We also presume that
the rules of LOGIC are infinite, timeless and immutable for any
conclusion to be tolerable, or have a continuing value.)


CAN ANYTHING BE KILLED ?

It is a fallacy, therefore to think that if a "form" is destroyed
(killed) that the THING IN ITSELF is DESTROYED. Only the present
temporary form is dispersed. The Energy, the Power that served
as a center to CREATE (by assemblage of the Skandhas (or
aggregates, Monads, samskaras, elementals, etc...) a BEING (on
any plane) cannot be destroyed as a KARMIC FORCE. It persists.
Its persistence HPB declares transcends the time-space of a
"Maha-Manvantara" -- a period of 311,040,000,000,000 years.
ISIS UNVEILED AND THE VISHISTADWAITA, article, "Theosophist,
Jan, 1886" ] (SD II 68-70)


VISIBLE and INVISIBLE -- WHICH IS FIRST ?

We generally consider the "invisible" to be non-existent,
unimportant, etc... There is however, a fact that cannot be
eliminated: Nothing exists as a form or manifesting Power, or
Energy, unless it is first formulated around an energic center on
the invisible planes of DESIRE (need, necessity), mental
formation by a MENTAL CREATIVE process (using mind-matter ?)
then, the assembly of a lattice of life-force and an "ASTRAL
PATTERN" (of electro-magnetic physical 'matter' -- see for
instance "Kirillian Photography"), on which the physical
molecules may assemble, each in its rightful place (How is a
"rightful place" determined? Is this incident based on Karma and
previous relations with these "building-blocks" of Nature ? How
is a particular atom or sub-atomic particle 'chosen?" Is the
"intelligence visible everywhere in the universe of great 'forms,
also to be traced with accurate action in the universe of the
very minute?' How can such diversity be monitored, adjusted,
directed? Who does that kind of work? Finally: What is the
GOAL of all this activity, of all these forms in action and life
? )


ONE ELEMENT -- SPACE	-- ALL ? NOTHING ?

SPACE is a word used in English (in this time frame) to indicate
the volume any OBJECT occupies. SPACE persists even when the
object "moves" away and occupies a different segment of "space."

SPACE as an indefinite infinite, means simply ALL. To this, the
metaphysician silently adds: "MANIFESTED SPACE, and mentally
says: this "space" is infinite, indefinite, ceaseless, and of
necessity is included in NON-MANIFESTED SPACE.


NON-MANIFESTED ! IS IT NOTHING or SOMETHING ?

NON-MANIFESTED SPACE (which includes some indefinite portion)
also includes the WHOLE of MANIFESTED SPACE.


MATTER -- WHERE? HOW ? WHERE DOES IT GO ?

Our MATTER (Every theoretical physicist and chemist is well aware
that the properties of any "matter' are theoretically derived
from the constitution of its molecular and atomic (and sub-atomic
structure -- such "structure" being purely a function of its
electro-magnetic configuration) in its present form and
manifestation.,

This condition (of 'form-encased' life) we are in (and in which
all other 'forms;' are presumed also to be) seems to always tend
to modify and "color" our mental, physical, and emotional
concepts (to use HPB's definition -- SD I 181 -- of the triple
evolutionary scheme that pervades NATURE ( Nature being another
synonym for ALL -- without any definition. ) On that page I 181,
she also says : "These three are the finite aspects or the
reflection on the field of Cosmic Illusion of ATMA, the seventh,
the one REALITY."


ATMA, ATMANAM, ANATMA, SPIRIT, NO-THING, etc. are all words
covering concepts of an indefinable INFINITE and ALL-PERVASIVE
REALITY.


Perhaps these ideas of one student will be of use to others. I
would be glad to consider any and all further concepts and glad
to receive any criticism, comments or adjustments.


W. Dallas TenBroeck
I-NET ADD: dalval14@earthlink.com

=============================================

-----Original Message-----
From: Moderator [mailto:nous@btinternet.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2000 3:46 PM
To: sd@blavatsky.net
Subject: [bn-sd] The First Fundamental Proposition THE SECRET
DOCTRINE

Friends,

If you have any further thoughts on the moral implications of our
study that
really do relate to our recent focus in the SD ie the ONE
ELEMENT, SPACE &
so on, then you are welcome to add them. However, as interesting
as a
seperate study of Karma and Compassion might be, we will not be
pursuing
that thread any further, at least not at the moment. No doubt we
will come
back to it in the course of our study a number of times.

We will now continue with our study of the PROEM and explore the
FIRST
FUNDAMENTAL PROPOSITION. The passages in the SD that cover this
run to
nearly three pages, so only the first part will be posted here
today. More
will be added in the coming days. You might want to spend some
time
reflecting on the passage below, even if you do not have the time
to write
into the group. The first part of the First Proposition is
below, between
the "=======" signs.

Comments and questions very welcome. We have already seen how
different
views invite us to understand in new ways and consider different
perspectives.

best wishes,

Peter Merriott

======================

(a) An Omnipresent, Eternal, Boundless, and Immutable PRINCIPLE
on which all
speculation is impossible, since it transcends the power of human
conception
and could only be dwarfed by any human expression or similitude.
It is
beyond the range and reach of thought -- in the words of
Mandukya,
"unthinkable and unspeakable."

To render these ideas clearer to the general reader, let him set
out with
the postulate that there is one absolute Reality which antecedes
all
manifested, conditioned, being. This Infinite and Eternal
Cause -- dimly
formulated in the "Unconscious" and "Unknowable" of current
European
philosophy -- is the rootless root of "all that was, is, or ever
shall be."
It is of course devoid of all attributes and is essentially
without any
relation to manifested, finite Being. It is "Be-ness" rather than
Being (in
Sanskrit, Sat), and is beyond all thought or speculation.

This "Be-ness" is symbolised in the Secret Doctrine under two
aspects. On
the one hand, absolute abstract Space, representing bare
subjectivity, the
one thing which no human mind can either exclude from any
conception, or
conceive of by itself. On the other, absolute Abstract Motion
representing
Unconditioned Consciousness. Even our Western thinkers have shown
that
Consciousness is inconceivable to us apart from change, and
motion best
symbolises change, its essential characteristic. This latter
aspect of the
one Reality, is also symbolised by the term "The Great Breath," a
symbol
sufficiently graphic to need no further elucidation. Thus, then,
the first
fundamental axiom of the Secret Doctrine is this metaphysical ONE
ABSOLUTE -- BE-NESS -- symbolised by finite intelligence as the
theological
Trinity. " (SD I 14)
==========================