Theos-Talk Archives (May 2000 Message tt00374)

Hi Dennis,

>> On the other hand, Creme has indicated 
>>that the point of evolution for
>> Blavatsky was 4.0 .
>
>Mr. Leadbeater also had a system of ranking 
>people according to their spiritual progress. 
>Is this what Creme is using?

I am not really aware what "system" Leadbeater used, but Benjamin Creme has
said that he worked this system out with the Master in order to have some
point of reference. Essentially, and obviously, 1.0 is the first
initiation.  At 1.5, the individual has achieved mental polarization.  At
2.0 is the 2nd initiation and the individual achieves spiritual (soul)
polarization at 2.5.  Obviously, 3.0 is the third initiation, 4.0 is the
fourth, and 5.0 is a Master.  It is an educational tool and the individual
can make a considered study of the point of development of past individuals
throughout history. The Master will not give out to the public any "points
of development" of living individuals.  The public only receives numbers on
past figures in history.

>I am pretty sure that he had a center in North 
>Hollywood about 10 years ago, and the claims made 
>then are just about the same as I am seeing again here.
>I was under the impression then that the "externalization" 
>would take place shortly. Shortly has come and gone.

The claim remains the same and has not changed.  The events leading up to
the externalization are more and more pronounced every day i.e., the
impending stock-market crash, etc.  The fact that it has remained
consistent for so many *DECADES* can also be seen that there is a degree of
internal stability and consistency to the story or the events.  Remember,
there are no profits or gain or fame being won here.  Only the story
remains the same and is consistently distributed to simply make known the
presence of Maitreya in the world.
  Benjamin Creme lives in London.  There is an address and small office in
North Hollywood which is used to coordinate activities from.  It is a
non-profit organization and they need some space to distribute book orders,
etc. 

>It is common to note in Spiritualist circles 
>that one class of spirit will try to flatter 
>the mediumistic person by telling them of the 
>spiritual wonders that they will accomplish, 
>and that they were specially chosen for this mission, 
>until they start taking orders from the spirit, 
>after which their life will go downhill fast. 
>Mr. Creme has been doing this longer than
>most mediums last under the influence.

That is all the more reason to consider that, perhaps it is not a "spirit"
that is giving him orders, but that he may, in fact, be in contact with a
Master.  Creme is still giving lectures and interviews on a regular basis
around the world.  He has been doing this for over 20 years now and his
message is more widespread now than ever before.  Yet he always speaks for
free and never accepts money for his lectures or interviews.  

>I have problems with the slow progress of this 
>Externalization, if any is to take place. Has 
>Creme been predicting when this EXT. will take place?

Yes, that has bothered many people.  It has been suggested that our sense
of time and process is much different than that of the Hierarchy and that
we are also only seeing a small piece of the puzzle.  From our perspective
it appears to be taking forever.  "Soon" can mean a week or a hundred
years, depending upon your perspective, I suppose.  It is not an event in
time, though.  That is what we need to understand.  It is a process.  The
process is inevitable, but the time is only a marker that we use to order
our lives.  We need to examine the process more than interpret the meaning
of "soon".   

>Do you get the impression it will be before 
>the next 12 years will pass? When I was
>reading the magazine 10 years ago, I am 
>pretty sure that they had a date
>fixed for it to happen, and that that date 
>came and went 8 to 10 years ago.

Periodically, there will periods of time where it is more likely for the
events to unfold.  It has a cylcic nature to it.  It waxes and wanes.  I
have felt that each "cylce" feels much more "inevitable" than the last,
however, I have also seen enough of these cycles come and go to know that I
wouldn't want to register an exact date of any sort.  I know that Benjamin
Creme syays that the level of ecxpectancy in the world can "speed up" the
process and so he tries to increase that level of expectancy.  He is often
quite sure of the potential for the events to unfold at each period, but he
has never stated that it wuold absolutely happen at such and such a time.  

>Are you saying that Wayne met a man who said that he was Maitreya?

Yes, he met him face to face.  And other Masters too.  I have met many
people now who have identified Maitreya as the individual that they had a
direct physical flesh meeting with.

>Saying, and Being, are sometimes not the same thing.  
>What could you say that would convince another that 
>this fellow is really Maitreya? 

There is nothing that *I* could say to convince anyone that this is
Maitreya.  I am simply giving out the information on it as factually and as
accurately as I can.  You will have to convince yourself of your own
conclusion, whatever they may be.  You will have to figure it out for
yourself if it is true or not....if you are interested.

>Is there any "proof" besides a congregation 
>who agree that this one is the One?

Well, it's more than simply a small closed group that believes in this.
There are strangers from all over the world having these experiences.  

Todd



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