Theos-Talk Archives (November 1998 Message tt00247)

Nov 16th

No - I do not mean to shout - simply to easily distinguish my
reply from your questions.

As to your rejoinders - well you have the books and those are the
same that I have.

I will take a while to answer your points.

In the meantime as I understand it Theosophy is a record of what
many millions of students have found out about NATURE which has
been under their investigation for many long ages  ( SD I 272-3).

The economy and ecology of Nature is "Effect follows cause."
Karma.  If we do unnecessary and destructive things no amount of
argument will put them right.

Best wishes,

Dallas

> From: D. Porter
> Sent:	Sunday, November 15, 1998 6:35 PM
> Subject: Part 2 - Dallas' Shouting Answers

My questions are in plaintext , Dallas' replies are in UPPERCASE
BOLD
SHOUTING...(so i get it)


>1 -	Why should I (we) accept that 'as above, so below' is an
>axiom?
>
>LOOK IN A MIRROR	--  IDEALS AND THOUGHT PRECEDE ALL FORMS.
>HOWEVER THE IMAGE IS INVERTED AND THE SEEKER HAS TO LEARN TO
>CONVERT WHAT HE SEES BACK TO REALITY.

What about looking in a mirror reflecting another mirror?

>2 -	What is the final goal? Non-existence?
>
>COMPLETE AWARENESS AND A KNOWLEDGE/WISDOM OF THE UNIVERSE, ITS
>LAWS AND WORKING.  EVERY LIFE WE SEEK TO ENLARGE THIS CAPACITY.

So it's not Nirvana then.

>3 -	Why do anything at all, especially incarnate?
>
>LAW COMPELS IT BECAUSE IN THE PAST WE HAVE DISTURBED THE DYNAMIC
>EQUILIBRIUM OF OUR UNIVERSE IT IS UP TO US TO RESTORE THAT
>HARMONY.  IT IS THE LAW OF RESPONSIBILITY AND DUTY THAT COMPELS
>THIS AND IT IS UNIVERSAL.  WE LIVE IN A UNIVERSE OF LAW.  AT
BASE
>WE ARE SPIRITUAL BEING WHO INCARNATE IN THE PHYSICAL WORLD SO
>THAT THE MATERIAL THERE MAY BE IMPROVED SPIRITUALLY, MORALLY AND
>ETHICALLY.  IF WE MISBEHAVE IN THOUGHT, WORD AND DEED WE RETARD
>THIS PROCESS AND SUFFER.

What caused the disequilibrium?

>4 -	Where is Guatama Buddha right now? He knows that we are all
>just figments of his imagination - so why help illusory beings?
>
>The BUDDHA IS ALIVE, WELL AND WORKING HARD.  WHEN HE BALANCED
HIS
>KARMIC DEBT HE HAD TWO OPTIONS:  1.  TO RETIRE AND "REST"  AND
>2.  TO CONTINUE WORKING FOR THE BENEFIT OF ALL THOSE AROUND HIM
>WHO HAD NOT YET ATTAINED TO BUDDHA-HOOD.  HE CHOSE THE LATTER
>COURSE [see SD I 207-210 if you have that book ]  THAT IS THE
>TEACHING OF THE MAHAYANA SCHOOL OF BUDDHISM.

Before I respond to this, and I don't want to sound nasty, I
would just
like to say, Dallas, why do you keep assuming I haven't read SD,
Key, ISIS,
etc when I have told you on at least 2 occasions I do. I have
read them and
understand them, but what HPB doesn't write is more interesting
than what
she does. She is constantly referring to things that initiates
can't reveal
so the SD etc can't be all encompassing - as I said in an earlier
post they
are a great exoteric introduction to theosophy and nothing more,
they do
however point in a sort of general direction to the esoteric
teachings.

Now to your response - So theosophy then is the presentation of
Mahayana
Buddhism and no other?


>5- Is loneliness the driving force of the absolute?


>NO - THE ABSOLUTE IS WITHOUT ANY QUALITIES OR LIMITATIONS SUCH
AS
>WE ARE SURROUNDED WITH IN TIME SPACE AND MOTION.  IT IS THE
>ETERNAL BACKGROUND FROM WHICH ALL EMERGES.  [ see SD  I  pp.
> 14 - 19 ]

The absolute is a purely metaphysical concept required so that we
can have
a sense of the unknown. Without the unknown there is no learning.
It is true to say that the absolute is without qualities in as
much as it
is true to say the absolute has all qualities even thoses we
don't know of
yet.

>6- Does every individual sperm have a unique 'entity' ?
>
>YES - IT IS THE "EFFECT" OF ITS OWN ENERGIC SELF.  IT STARTS AS
A
>SPIRITUAL FORCE AND ESTABLISHES UNDER THE LAW OF KARMA (which is
>its past series of actions and choices) THE CAUSES FOR ITS
>EMERGENCE AS THE VEHICLE OF A MIND-ENTITY - A HUMAN BEING.
>HOWEVER IT IS THE MIND-ENTITY THAT CAUSES THE "GERM" AND NOT THE
>"GERM" THAT CAUSES THE MIND.

So I'm carrying around a few million people of which only one (or
twins
etc) has the karma to cause birth the rest die and do it again
and again
again, in my balls (testicles for the layman). It's just that I
read in
some buddhism (not sure which school, Sogyal Rinpoche's I think)
the spirit
(i don't want to get into an argument about the use of that word
either)
does not enter the vehicle until conception. And that the spirits
that want
to incarnate gather around the love making couple and that the
sex is
determined by who the spirit is more attracted to. If it likes
the male it
will incarnate female and vice versa (obvioulsy some highly
evolved beings
love both equally and are born androgynous or hermaphroditic).


>7- Is onanism murder of sperm?

>
>USE A DICTIONARY, AND CONSULT YOUR OWN SENSE OF JUSTICE AND
>FAIRNESS TO THE ASSEMBLY OF LIVING BEINGS THAT CONSTITUTE THE
>SPERM.  KARMA IS BALANCE, FAIRNESS AND JUSTICE.  WHAT IS THE
>CAUSE OF "ONANISM ?"  NONE CAN EVER ESCAPE THE RESULTS OF THEIR
>CHOICES.  HENCE KARMA IS UNIVERSAL AND ALSO INDIVIDUAL AND
>PERSONAL IN ITS ACTION - THAT IS WHY MOTIVE AND ETHICS AND
MORALS
>ARE SO IMPORTANT.  THE PRACTICE OF BROTHERHOOD IS THE BEGINNING
>OF THE PATH THAT LEADS TO THE BALANCE OF KARMA AND BUDDHA-HOOD.
>WE TEND TO THINK BECAUSE WE USE A LARGE PHYSICAL BODY AND
>PHYSICALLY THAT THE SPERM OR GERM IS SMALL THAT WE CAN BULLY IT.
>HOWEVER IT HAS A STRENGTH EQUAL OR SUPERIOR TO OURS AND WE
>MANIPULATE IT OR USE IT AT OUR PERIL - CONSIDERING THE FUTURE
>CONSEQUENCES UNDER KARMA THAT MAY BECOME OURS.


Onanism is masturbation in my dictionary (Oxford Concise) and
murder is
killing another living being (although common law defintion would
not
include anything but humans in this defintion).

In my sense of justice I think that the sperm is totally reliant
on our
desire to ever be able to occupy a human body (if that is what it
desires,
which we must to be otherwise it would have no cause).

I think I've prove one point here. Karma is guilt. That is the
mechanism of
Karma. Although we may feel no guilt because our rational mind
has
justified our actions, everything we do is also kept at another
level - the
subconscious. Transpersonal Pschology which is a direct offshoot
of Alchemy
thanks to Jung teaches how to deal with our Karma Now, not in the
next
life. This is too big a thesis for me to start on now, but it
does come
back to my experience with drugs and altered states of
consciousness. In
these states we are able to face these buried events and deal
with them in
the present.


>8- What happens to the sperm that don't make it - try and try
>again?
>
>
>
>AS JUST SAID THE GERM OR SPERM IS NOT THE CAUSE.  WHO OR WHAT
>GENERATED IT AND WHY ?  IT HAS ITS OWN LIFE AND WE CAN ACT AS
ITS
>ASSISTANTS OR ITS OBSTRUCTORS - THESE ARE THE ACTIONS OF KARMA -
>WHICH WE INVOKE WHEN WE ACT.

Was it not generated 'as above so below' - from what we know, our
desires
and our physical body which produced it's material form - and the
unknown ,
that pure mystical absolute - of which union with is the modern
taboo?

>9- Does the egg have all 7 principles before fertilization?

>
>POTENTIALLY YES.  ALL BEINGS HAVE THE 7 PRINCIPLES EITHER LATENT
>OR ACTIVE IN THEM.  CONSIDER THE MEANING OF THE IDEA OF
"MONAD" -
>YOU REALLY OUGHT TO USE AND STUDY "THE KEY TO THEOSOPHY"  YOU
>WOULD FIND THAT MOST OF YOUR QUESTIONS ARE ANSWERED THERE.

Nothing keeps one from the truth like theososophy.

And you can quote me on that.

>10 -	Can more than one entity occupy a physical body at the same
>time?
>
>
>
>WHY ?  UNDER WHAT LAW DO YOU THINK THIS MIGHT OCCUR ?  [ see SD
>II 167 ] FOR A MORE COMPLETE ANSWER TO THIS.  If you wish to
deal
>with Theosophy then you must become familiar with at least one
of
>the basic texts.  Try using the KEY.  Make sure it has an Index
>and that you use this under the headings you are interested in.

Yes I see now. My individual thinking must conform to the group
thinking
otherwise there is no harmony. Without harmony there can be no
equilibrium.
In equilibrium there is no motion. Without motion force can not
be
discerned. Without force there is no matter. Without Matter there
is no
spirit. Without either there is NOTHING.


========	DALLAS	==================
>
>I HOPE THIS IS OF SOME HELP.
>
>Dal.
>
>Regards,
>
>Darren the Seeker
>

I DON"T KNOW  - DO YOU THINK SO?

Namaste as Always,

Node D